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  • Tue, Jun 4 2019 2:34 PM

    • Fish
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    Mac Pro 2019 and Avid Media Composer

    Very excited to see Avid featured so prominently in the Keynote yesterday.

    How exactly will the Avid hardware work? Are there new boards going to be released or are existing ones compatible? If new, is a card all that is required? Does it have basic I/O (e.g. HDMI)? Or do we still need some kind of box? Will the box or the card offer acceleration options for Avid processes? To what advantage? If new cards, will they be available in the fall? If existing cards are compatible, will they be Mac Pro ready when the Mac Pro is released? Will the MC work with Afterburner? Will Afterburner utilize MC codecs or is it strictly ProRes? Thank you...and apologies if this isn't the correct forum. Happy to repost elsewhere if directed.

    ><({(º> 
    2012 Westmere MacPro 2 x 2.66 GHz 6-Core Intel Xeon) 6 GB 1333 MHz DDR3 ECC ATI Radeon HD 5870 1024 MB As of Jan 2015 - OS X 10.9.5 (13F34) [view my complete system specs]

    AVID man, AVID fan (since 1993 with version 4.5 - before multiple tracks!)...like to solve my own problems and I try not to bother anyone unless I'm really stumped.

  • Tue, Jun 4 2019 4:54 PM In reply to

    • Marianna
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    Re: Mac Pro 2019 and Avid Media Composer

    Hey Fish

    Yes it was good to see Avid mentioned.  But as you can see from the PR from Apple, Pro Tools was mentioned.  Avid doesnt hve any info to share on MC as of yet and note the Mac wont be officially out til fall 2019. 

    All I can say is.....

    "   Yes we’re excited that Apple’s announcement about the new Mac Pro, which is planned for Fall 2019 availability, shows that Avid is taking advantage of the incredible expansion capabilities to do something never before possible in a single workstation. We enable support for up to 6 HDX cards to yield more I/O, increased voices, and two times the DSP processing that any other system can achieve. While we’re not at liberty to offer further insight at this time, please stay tuned to Apple for future developments.  https://www.apple.com/newsroom/2019/06/apple-unveils-powerful-all-new-mac-pro-and-groundbreaking-pro-display-xdr/  "

    Wish I had more to say but.... I dont.

    Marianna

    Director of CSM | Customer Advocate [view my complete system specs]
  • Tue, Jun 4 2019 5:35 PM In reply to

    • Fish
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    Re: Mac Pro 2019 and Avid Media Composer

    Thanks Marianna!

     

    We anxiously await more news.

    2012 Westmere MacPro 2 x 2.66 GHz 6-Core Intel Xeon) 6 GB 1333 MHz DDR3 ECC ATI Radeon HD 5870 1024 MB As of Jan 2015 - OS X 10.9.5 (13F34) [view my complete system specs]

    AVID man, AVID fan (since 1993 with version 4.5 - before multiple tracks!)...like to solve my own problems and I try not to bother anyone unless I'm really stumped.

  • Tue, Jun 4 2019 9:32 PM In reply to

    Re: Mac Pro 2019 and Avid Media Composer

    Fish:
    How exactly will the Avid hardware work?

     

    I don't see how the new Mac Pro will change anything in terms of I/O box. You should be able to use the current I/O boxes. I assume Apple will use PCIe Gen3 similar to HP z8G4 and z4G4s.

    It is more of a driver issue for the new macOS.

    Acceleration from I/O BOBs is dead. While the Red Rocket and this new Apple Afterburner do offer it, they are task and codec specific for a niche market.

    And Afterburner seems to be strictly ProRes RAW and not ProRes proxy, LT, 422 or HQ. So I doubt there will be any support for DNxHR or R3D or BM RAW or any other 3rd party codec.

     

    MC 2020.6, W10, MSI X299M, Intel 9940X, Gigabyte 2080Ti Waterforce, 64GB RAM, Samsung 970 EVO M.2 SSD, BM Mini monitor & Dell UP2718Q. MBP 2012 Thunderbolt... [view my complete system specs]
  • Tue, Jun 4 2019 9:42 PM In reply to

    • dklein
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    Re: Mac Pro 2019 and Avid Media Composer

    I’m curious to see how support will work as well. It would be great if we could just pop over existing Nitris or Mojo cards into the 2019 Mac Pro PCI slots. The big thing to keep in mind is the MacOS 10.15 is completely dropping support for 32 bit software and thus there is no DNXHD support outside of Avid MC (and applications that have 64 bit decoders built into themselves). The OS itself will only support Apple codecs in AVFoundation so it’s doubtful that we will see any non ProRes support in Afterburner, though keep in mind the T2 chip has a hardware accelerator for H264 and H265/HEVC. 

    i haven’t personally worked with ProRes as my offline codec since my FCP days, but it is technically supported by Avid. Maybe with the 2019 MP it’s worth looking into a ProRes start to finish workflow rather then DnX?

  • Tue, Jun 4 2019 9:51 PM In reply to

    • Fish
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    Re: Mac Pro 2019 and Avid Media Composer

    I just read an article and can confirm that the Afterburner is a ProRes accelerator only. No surprise there. And that’s fine. Less money to fork out. 

     

    My opinion is that I will get such a speed boost over my existing system that I won’t feel much of a need (for a while) to jump into systems that support multiple streams of RAW. Are you saying there is no accelerator advantage to the Artist series? I thought the I/Q box offered some kind of “kick” to the streaming. No?
    I too am wondering about using my Nitris for a while with the new system. I do not require 4K output in a live video stream (although would not object to it).
    2012 Westmere MacPro 2 x 2.66 GHz 6-Core Intel Xeon) 6 GB 1333 MHz DDR3 ECC ATI Radeon HD 5870 1024 MB As of Jan 2015 - OS X 10.9.5 (13F34) [view my complete system specs]

    AVID man, AVID fan (since 1993 with version 4.5 - before multiple tracks!)...like to solve my own problems and I try not to bother anyone unless I'm really stumped.

  • Tue, Jun 4 2019 10:02 PM In reply to

    Re: Mac Pro 2019 and Avid Media Composer

    dklein:
    It would be great if we could just pop over existing Nitris or Mojo cards into the 2019 Mac Pro PCI slots

     

    With an assumption that the PCIe slots will be Gen 3, you will not be able to move the Nitris DX since it only supports Gen 1/2. Maybe Apple and Avid can make it work, but it does not work with HP systems with Gen 3 slots.

    dklein:
    The big thing to keep in mind is the MacOS 10.15 is completely dropping support for 32 bit software and thus there is no DNXHD support outside of Avid MC (and applications that have 64 bit decoders built into themselves).

     

    Not quite. It is up to each software developer to add specific codecs outside of the AVFoundation. Adobe and Resolve already have DNx codec support natively.

    dklein:
    though keep in mind the T2 chip has a hardware accelerator for H264 and H265/HEVC. 

    T2 is a pre BIO security chip. I think Apple is using Intel's QuickSync for the 264/265 acceleration.

     

    dklein:
    Maybe with the 2019 MP it’s worth looking into a ProRes start to finish workflow rather then DnX?

    I don't see how this new computer adds anything to your decision of adding ProRes or not. The Afterburner card only supports ProRes RAW (probably the Debayering portion of the codec). So even that does not add anything new to existing ProRes workflows.

     

     

    MC 2020.6, W10, MSI X299M, Intel 9940X, Gigabyte 2080Ti Waterforce, 64GB RAM, Samsung 970 EVO M.2 SSD, BM Mini monitor & Dell UP2718Q. MBP 2012 Thunderbolt... [view my complete system specs]
  • Tue, Jun 4 2019 10:06 PM In reply to

    Re: Mac Pro 2019 and Avid Media Composer

    Fish:
    Are you saying there is no accelerator advantage to the Artist series?

    It does have the DNx codec hardware but AFAIK this only assists with baseband capture (SDI).

     

    Fish:
    I too am wondering about using my Nitris for a while with the new system. I do not require 4K output in a live video stream (although would not object to it).

    I doubt it will but I guess we need to wait for Avid to confirm.

    MC 2020.6, W10, MSI X299M, Intel 9940X, Gigabyte 2080Ti Waterforce, 64GB RAM, Samsung 970 EVO M.2 SSD, BM Mini monitor & Dell UP2718Q. MBP 2012 Thunderbolt... [view my complete system specs]
  • Tue, Jun 4 2019 10:11 PM In reply to

    • Fish
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    Re: Mac Pro 2019 and Avid Media Composer

    I've been planning on replacing the Nitris with the Artist anyway.

     

    I would have been shocked if the PCI cards were still compatible with tech from 2012!

    2012 Westmere MacPro 2 x 2.66 GHz 6-Core Intel Xeon) 6 GB 1333 MHz DDR3 ECC ATI Radeon HD 5870 1024 MB As of Jan 2015 - OS X 10.9.5 (13F34) [view my complete system specs]

    AVID man, AVID fan (since 1993 with version 4.5 - before multiple tracks!)...like to solve my own problems and I try not to bother anyone unless I'm really stumped.

  • Tue, Jun 4 2019 10:14 PM In reply to

    • dklein
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    Re: Mac Pro 2019 and Avid Media Composer

    Dom Q. Silverio:

    dklein:
    though keep in mind the T2 chip has a hardware accelerator for H264 and H265/HEVC. 

    T2 is a pre BIO security chip. I think Apple is using Intel's QuickSync for the 264/265 acceleration.

    While the T2 is primarily a security chip, it does include the hardware accelerator for H264 and HEVC. This is how the iMac Pro has hardware accelerated encoding for these codecs despite having a Xeon processor, which doesn’t support Quicksync.

    Dom Q. Silverio:

    dklein:
    Maybe with the 2019 MP it’s worth looking into a ProRes start to finish workflow rather then DnX?

    I don't see how this new computer adds anything to your decision of adding ProRes or not. The Afterburner card only supports ProRes RAW (probably the Debayering portion of the codec). So even that does not add anything new to existing ProRes workflows.

    Per AppleInsider, the Afterburner supports ProRes and ProRes Raw accelerations. Link: https://appleinsider.com/articles/19/06/04/frequently-asked-questions-about-the-afterburner-accelerator-for-the-mac-pro

  • Wed, Jun 5 2019 12:55 AM In reply to

    • Andrew
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    Re: Mac Pro 2019 and Avid Media Composer

    I also watched the keynote yesterday.  I will admit I was surprised Avid got mentioned being that Apple is pushing Final Cut Pro.

    Avid MC v2020.12, macOS Big Sur 11.1 (w/out dongle), iMac 21.5-inch, late 2015 (purchased new on Jan. 2017), Processor: 2.8 GHz Intel Core i5, Memory:... [view my complete system specs]
  • Wed, Jun 5 2019 1:23 AM In reply to

    Re: Mac Pro 2019 and Avid Media Composer

    Afaik and reading that article, T2 is wholly dependent on Quick Sync and it’s role is limited. Quick Sync is doing the heavy lifting. And even then Quick Sync supports only specific profiles and settings. 

    i also don’t see any reference for H264/265 acceleration with the iMac Pro other than Xeon multi core efficiencies. 

     

    Regarding Afterburner, that would be great that it supports non RAW ProRes. 

    MC 2020.6, W10, MSI X299M, Intel 9940X, Gigabyte 2080Ti Waterforce, 64GB RAM, Samsung 970 EVO M.2 SSD, BM Mini monitor & Dell UP2718Q. MBP 2012 Thunderbolt... [view my complete system specs]
  • Wed, Jun 5 2019 1:37 AM In reply to

    • dklein
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    Re: Mac Pro 2019 and Avid Media Composer

    Hi Dom,

    AppleInsider did a test back in April comparing the 2018 Mac Mini i3 with both a T2 and QuickSync against the iMac 4K with just QuickSync and there was a noticable difference with the T2 chip.

    https://appleinsider.com/articles/19/04/09/apples-t2-chip-makes-a-giant-difference-in-video-encoding-for-most-users

    Edit:

    Sorry I was mobile earlier, but here's the link to the Apple Press Release for the 2018 Mac Mini that states:

    "T2 also features HEVC video transcoding that’s up to an incredible 30 times faster, enabling pro users to work more quickly with higher resolution video throughout their workflow."

    Link: https://www.apple.com/newsroom/2018/10/new-mac-mini-packs-huge-punch/

  • Wed, Jun 5 2019 2:06 AM In reply to

    Re: Mac Pro 2019 and Avid Media Composer

    Maybe it’s me but I read that as Quicksync vs no QS. it doesn’t say iMac without Quick Sync vs Mac Mini with T2 only. There is no benchmark with just T2. I don’t think that is possible. Or I have not seen a benchmark. 

     

    If you follow the Hackintosh crowd, there are also hypothesis that Apple is using AMDs implementation of Quick Sync called VCE. T2 May play a role but again the heavy lifting is done by another hardware  AMD GPU in this case. 

    MC 2020.6, W10, MSI X299M, Intel 9940X, Gigabyte 2080Ti Waterforce, 64GB RAM, Samsung 970 EVO M.2 SSD, BM Mini monitor & Dell UP2718Q. MBP 2012 Thunderbolt... [view my complete system specs]
  • Wed, Jun 5 2019 2:19 AM In reply to

    • dklein
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    Re: Mac Pro 2019 and Avid Media Composer

    My understanding is that all modern macs that don’t have Xeon processors have QuickSync support in their Intel processors. This is because Intel hasn’t added QuickSync to the Xeon processor, so only the Mac Pros and iMac Pros are affected.  There is no AMD GPU in the Mac Mini, it’s strictly an integrated Intel UHD 630. And if you look at the Apple Press Release I linked to previously, they explicitly state the T2 is handling the encoding enhancement. 

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