Latest post Sun, Feb 20 2011 7:25 AM by oze. 17 replies.
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  • Wed, Feb 9 2011 1:22 AM

    • oze
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    Arri Alexa and Arriraw workflow . . ?

    Hi, I'm familiar with Metafuze and Red but have my first Alexa job (a commercial) coming up and thought I should find out about the workflow. I am guessing that MC5 will not mount the files via AMA so transcoding in MC is a non-starter, so I am assuming that Metafuze will work with the Arriraw format and that the work-flow is basically the same as Red was handled pre MC 5. We will be wanting to grade directly off the Arriraw files so it's essential that the final EDL be able to address folders as reel numbers and proper timecode.

    Am I correct? I would be most appreciative of any help or guidance.

    Thanks

    2017 27" iMac i7 4.2, 2TB PCI memory, 64GB RAM, OS 10.13.6, MC 2018.10 [view my complete system specs]
  • Wed, Feb 9 2011 2:48 AM In reply to

    • MichaelP
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    Re: Arri Alexa and Arriraw workflow . . ?

    MetaFuze supports Arris D21, but not ArriRAW from Alexa at this time.Otherwise, yes. It would have been a similar workflow.

     

    Michael

    24p.com

  • Wed, Feb 9 2011 3:17 AM In reply to

    • oze
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    Re: Arri Alexa and Arriraw workflow . . ?

    So what's the best solution? Rushes through a post-facility by the sound of it or forget Arridraw altogether and transcode Pro Res 422 via AMA and then grade off Pro Res 444 files . . ?

    2017 27" iMac i7 4.2, 2TB PCI memory, 64GB RAM, OS 10.13.6, MC 2018.10 [view my complete system specs]
  • Wed, Feb 9 2011 3:52 AM In reply to

    • jef
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    Re: Arri Alexa and Arriraw workflow . . ?

    Well, as of a couple of days ago, ArriRaw was not offically available.  Only the ProRes files.  Check with the DP to make sure.  Arri has let a FEW cameras out that are Raw enabled. 

    I just finished a spot which was from Alexa.  Everyone thought it would be Raw files until right before the shoot when they realized that ProRes was all that was available.  Lots of confusion about this right now.

    Jef

    Avid DS 11.0.2 R.I.P | MC "Well, it depends ..." 2023.3.1 iMac w Big Sur and 2018.12.7 on Windows 10 Boot Camp [view my complete system specs]

    _____________________________________________

    Jef Huey

    Senior Editor

  • Wed, Feb 9 2011 8:05 AM In reply to

    • oze
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    Re: Arri Alexa and Arriraw workflow . . ?

    jef:

    Well, as of a couple of days ago, ArriRaw was not offically available.  Only the ProRes files.  Check with the DP to make sure.  Arri has let a FEW cameras out that are Raw enabled. 

    I just finished a spot which was from Alexa.  Everyone thought it would be Raw files until right before the shoot when they realized that ProRes was all that was available.  Lots of confusion about this right now.

    Jef

    Thanks Jeff, I'm looking into that now. I think you may be right. Did you end up finishing from the 4444 files?

    2017 27" iMac i7 4.2, 2TB PCI memory, 64GB RAM, OS 10.13.6, MC 2018.10 [view my complete system specs]
  • Wed, Feb 9 2011 11:01 AM In reply to

    • MichaelP
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    Re: Arri Alexa and Arriraw workflow . . ?

    You will also need to process outside the system if shooting with LogC on your ProRes files.

     

    Michael

    24p.com

  • Wed, Feb 9 2011 6:31 PM In reply to

    Re: Arri Alexa and Arriraw workflow . . ?

    Alexa can only deliver ProRes encoded Quicktime files at this time. Those will play back in real time without importing in MC5. On older versions you will have to import first, or you could use MetaFuze to offload this process to other machines.

     

     

    Igor Ridanovic

    www.HDhead.com

  • Wed, Feb 9 2011 6:39 PM In reply to

    Re: Arri Alexa and Arriraw workflow . . ?

    MichaelP:
    You will also need to process outside the system if shooting with LogC on your ProRes files.

    Hi Michael,

    What type of outside processing workflow would you currently recommend?

     

    Thx

    Job.

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  • Wed, Feb 9 2011 7:06 PM In reply to

    • Tommyp
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    Re: Arri Alexa and Arriraw workflow . . ?

    MichaelP:

    You will also need to process outside the system if shooting with LogC on your ProRes files.

     

    Michael

    Not really, you just have to color the footage in MC to have it look nice.  If it was recorded in LogC, it will appear very flat, but there wil be a lot of range to push the color where you want it to go. MC can certainly do that. -  (This is all for the offline) So you can directly use the LogC ProRes 4444 QT's if you want.

    Some people are recording ProRes on the in-camera card as LogC and then connecting a KiaPro and recording a Rec709 output for their dailes, then conform to the LogC files once they have picture lock. A very effective workflow. That is how we are handling our current Alexa shot jobs.

    Many paths to the same destination.

    Tom

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  • Wed, Feb 9 2011 7:52 PM In reply to

    Re: Arri Alexa and Arriraw workflow . . ?

    Tommyp:
    Not really, you just have to color the footage in MC to have it look nice.

    Which is pretty nasty as soon as you matchframe or want to compare an unused (ungraded) take to a used (graded) one. I used to work that way on my first Red projects, but if possible, would prefer to avoid this method.

    Tommyp:
    Some people are recording ProRes on the in-camera card as LogC and then connecting a KiaPro and recording a Rec709 output for their dailes, then conform to the LogC files once they have picture lock. A very effective workflow.

    I've always felt that is very tricky, as you never know 100% sure that what you have on one medium is what you have on the other. Years ago a colleague did an HDCAM feature where they co-recorded on DVCAM. They ended up having to exchange a few shots that had been recorded on DVCAM, but that were not on the HDCAMs.

    Media Composer Symphony | PT Ultimate | Win10 HPZ | OSX MBP | ISIS5000 [view my complete system specs]
  • Wed, Feb 9 2011 8:02 PM In reply to

    • Tommyp
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    Re: Arri Alexa and Arriraw workflow . . ?

    I hear you Job. All valid concerns. I'm used to cutting on DS, so we just set a souce side CC and that problem goes away. Not sure if you can do something similar on MC? I'm sure someone will let me know if you can.

    As for the dual record, it's been pretty solid. (good DIT's I guess) On the flip side of that is the option to record Rec 709 ProRes 422 QT's on the camera and rec LogC to a HDCAMSR recorder on the output. 

    The other option is to wash them through something like Clipster and add a 709 LUT, which is what they were getting at earlier. 

     

    Tom

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  • Wed, Feb 9 2011 8:13 PM In reply to

    • jef
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    Re: Arri Alexa and Arriraw workflow . . ?

    oze:
    Thanks Jeff, I'm looking into that now. I think you may be right. Did you end up finishing from the 4444 files?

    We offlined in MC with DNx copies of the shoot footage which had been treated in our DaVinci Resolve with the offical Arri LUT for LogC.

    I then published an EDL for which was used by the Resolve Colorist to conform and correct shots directly from the LogC nonLUT footage.  They made DPX files.  I imported those into DS for effects and final finish in a 4:4:4 23.98 sequence.  I then converted to 4:2:2 59.94 and SD.

    Some bumps along the way based on current file based workflow issues between MC and DS.  But still it seemed like the highest quality.

    Jef

     

    Avid DS 11.0.2 R.I.P | MC "Well, it depends ..." 2023.3.1 iMac w Big Sur and 2018.12.7 on Windows 10 Boot Camp [view my complete system specs]

    _____________________________________________

    Jef Huey

    Senior Editor

  • Wed, Feb 9 2011 8:53 PM In reply to

    Re: Arri Alexa and Arriraw workflow . . ?

    Tommyp:
    so we just set a souce side CC and that problem goes away. Not sure if you can do something similar on MC?

    There's source based CC in Symhony (which I also own), but it is applied in the timeline, not to the actual source side.

     

    Tommyp:
    good DIT's I guess
    Yeah, they are absolutely key.

     

    Thanks for your tips. I'll explore preprocessing in Clipster. I don't think they'll want to opt for an SR recorder.

    Media Composer Symphony | PT Ultimate | Win10 HPZ | OSX MBP | ISIS5000 [view my complete system specs]
  • Wed, Feb 9 2011 10:50 PM In reply to

    • OliverPeters
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    Re: Arri Alexa and Arriraw workflow . . ?

    Job ter Burg:
    There's source based CC in Symhony (which I also own), but it is applied in the timeline, not to the actual source side.

    Actually I think he means effects applied to the source before being edited to the timeline, just like in FCP. Ultimately Avid will probably need to add AMA source settings to ProRes or ARRIRAW files, just like with RED footage.

    - Oliver

     

  • Wed, Feb 9 2011 10:55 PM In reply to

    Re: Arri Alexa and Arriraw workflow . . ?

    OliverPeters:
    Actually I think he means effects applied to the source before being edited to the timeline

    Yeah, I got that.

    OliverPeters:
    Ultimately Avid will probably need to add AMA source settings to ProRes or ARRIRAW files, just like with RED footage

    OTOH, why wouldn't Arri work on that themselves? It requires some AMA plugin design. Today I heard that 80-90% of the national advertising here in Holland has switched from 16/35mm to Alexa.

    Media Composer Symphony | PT Ultimate | Win10 HPZ | OSX MBP | ISIS5000 [view my complete system specs]
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