Latest post Mon, Apr 2 2012 8:27 PM by abramkat. 633 replies.
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  • Wed, Jan 26 2011 4:23 PM In reply to

    • switthaus
    • Top 50 Contributor
    • Joined on Thu, Oct 13 2005
    • Cobbs Creek, VA
    • Posts 2,260
    • Points 30,670

    Re: MC5 Interface Settings Referendum - PLEASE PARTICIPATE!

    BarkinMadd:
    The complexity of testing grows geometrically with the number of variations in workflow. Flexibility is great, but it does cost $$ in testing and potentially leads to product instabilities.

    Exactly.  and sooner or later the options and legacy versions become so far apart that it is not practicle.  So maybe thats not a good idea after all...

    Scott Witthaus

    Owner/Editor/Post Production Supervisor 1708 Editorial

    http://vimeopro.com/1708editorial/1708-editorial

  • Wed, Jan 26 2011 5:32 PM In reply to

    • Mike Stewart
    • Not Ranked
    • Joined on Wed, Dec 16 2009
    • Toronto
    • Posts 66
    • Points 1,105

    Re: MC5 Interface Settings Referendum - PLEASE PARTICIPATE!

    I appreciate what Avid tried to do with the new Timeline settings but as you can see the "Only one segment tool can be enabled at a time" box doesn't seem to work. I set this at least 3 times a day, it works until I lasso anything on the timeline and reverts to STD smart tool

    Please Avid, whatever else it is you are working on, give us an update that has a fully disabled smart tool as an option.

    Model Name: PC/Windows 10 Processor Name: Intel Core i7 4770 GTX 1080 titan and GTX 1060 [view my complete system specs]
  • Wed, Jan 26 2011 7:10 PM In reply to

    • DavidJS5
    • Not Ranked
    • Joined on Sun, Jul 25 2010
    • Posts 28
    • Points 340

    Re: MC5 Interface Settings Referendum - PLEASE PARTICIPATE!

    Yes please resolve and fix these issues that Larry and the many many other CUSTOMERS of V5 have indicated as major show stoppers to a fluid workflow ASAP. Avid your first and foremost duty should be to the current customers of V5. Personally I can't understand why Avid wants to continue seeing this board full of complaints instead of quickly addressing the issues and seeing this board full of praise. A prompt fix to these issues is a win win for Avid and it's customers. Dragging this out for any longer is clearly a lose lose situation. To me the direction to go is an easy pick.   

    MC 5.5, Win 7 pro 64, ASUS P8P67 MB, 3.3Ghz Core i5-2500K,8 GB Corsair DDR3 1600, Quadro FX 560 (190.38) or GeForce 460, SB Audigy Sound Card, Shuttle... [view my complete system specs]
  • Wed, Jan 26 2011 7:41 PM In reply to

    Re: MC5 Interface Settings Referendum - PLEASE PARTICIPATE!

    switthaus:
    sooner or later the options and legacy versions become so far apart that it is not practicle.
    Not practicle?? Give me a break.  For it's whole life Avid has introduced functions and features with on and off abilities via the settings panel.

    Simply if you want to introduce something new to attract a small but targeted part of the market (Smart Tool for instance) you introduce it with a setting that allows any user to TURN it ON if  and when THEY want to. Then dip into unfamiliar Avid territory and market the ....... out of this "wonderfull" new idea. Follow that with details of how to turn it on and some of the excellent tutorials (like Steve's) on how to get the best out of it.

    Sometime in the future when the usage is properly understood either make the new function a default or scrap it (whichever is appropriate) 

    For me that would be basic planning. The vast existing user base does not get a very rude shock with an upgrade whilst the targeted market gets their option to customise Avid to suit their desires. A simple win win.

  • Wed, Jan 26 2011 7:57 PM In reply to

    • Atomike
    • Top 150 Contributor
    • Joined on Thu, Oct 13 2005
    • Nebraska
    • Posts 755
    • Points 11,515

    Re: MC5 Interface Settings Referendum - PLEASE PARTICIPATE!

    To futher illustrate Andrew's excellent point, I'll point to the Marquee Title Tool. Is there any real problem with having both the new, and legacy options available? So far, having the Standard and Marquee Title tools is fine - one for fancy work, one for quick work. Perfect.

    Media Composer version: usually newest release, or 1 behind. Nvidia GTX 1070Ti Windows 10, Core i7 8700K processor, ASRock GA 1151 Z370 Motherboard... [view my complete system specs]

    I spend most of my time between New York and Los Angeles.  In Nebraska.

  • Wed, Jan 26 2011 8:44 PM In reply to

    Re: MC5 Interface Settings Referendum - PLEASE PARTICIPATE!

    Atomike:
    I'll point to the Marquee Title Tool. Is there any real problem with having both the new, and legacy options available? So far, having the Standard and Marquee Title tools is fine - one for fancy work, one for quick work. Perfect.

    Mike makes an excellent point. The introduction of the Marquee title tool was in response to many Avid users' request for a titler that had more capabilities then the standard tool. Most importantly, the design team at the time clearly realized that while SOME users wanted it, NOT ALL users did, or would opt to use it. So with that in mind, they gave us the option to promote or not promote to Marquee, to create or not create in Marquee.  The current design team needs to learn the lesson that the previous team clearly knew. With all due respect, do not force unrequested changes to the interface down the throats of our existing user base. Let them choose for themselves. New features are one thing, changes to existing tool sets are quite another.

    As I've said many times before, we, the users, are the ones who are tasked with using these tools on a daily basis in high pressure environments, which is clearly different from the environment designers work in. And we are expected by our bosses to be productive, no matter what. They don't want to hear excuses, they don't want to hear the details - they just want and expect results. And if they don't consistently get those results, people lose their jobs. The negative effects on established workflows that some of these interface changes have generated have already resulted in some people getting those pink slips. I hope the current design team fully understands that issue.

    Newscutter Nitris DX 9.5.3.5 * Media Composer 5.5.3.6 (At Home on PC running XP Pro) * Symphony 6.5.2.1 (At home on MacBook Pro3,1 running 10.7.2) * Interplay... [view my complete system specs]

    Larry Rubin

    Senior Editor

    The Pentagon Channel

    www.pentagonchannel.mil

  • Wed, Jan 26 2011 8:50 PM In reply to

    • Joe M
    • Top 150 Contributor
    • Joined on Sat, Sep 9 2006
    • Southwestern part of US
    • Posts 952
    • Points 12,785

    Re: MC5 Interface Settings Referendum - PLEASE PARTICIPATE!

    BarkinMadd:

    Onc challenge in making so many optional modes is the complexity introduced to the QA testing process. The complexity of testing grows geometrically with the number of variations in workflow. Flexibility is great, but it does cost $$ in testing and potentially leads to product instabilities.

     

    That is probably correct... but if you look at AVID's audio mixer... it has several modes to operate audio editing (...and IMHO multi-click/keystroke-like confusing for something that should be relatively straightforward).  So... I believe AVID can accomplish the ability to make multi-mode operations within AVID.

    Unfortunately if you look closely.... for example.... locked inside of the Audio Mixer's Automation Mode the ST is used to delete and adjust audio keyframes... which means ST is probably much more intergrated into MC5... and, putting a "OFF" button to the ST may do exactly what you mentioned... increase costs, reduced stability and delayed upgrades.   And... I am certain there are other ST intergrations that probably makes ST much harder to turn "OFF" than most of us realize... Which is one reason why I think AVID should come out and say... We can not simply remove or turn off ST because_______________________fill in the blank________________.

    This would go a long way in providing customers with some sort of feeling of input and reasonable expectations.

    WinXP,ASUS W6T6 WS Rev.,Intel i7 3.2Ghz8X32,6G Corsair DDR3(low lat.),Quatro FX 3800(190.38),Adaptec 5405 RAID 0 SAS-2 Stripes 2x15K RPM Fujitsu 300G ea... [view my complete system specs]

    .

  • Wed, Jan 26 2011 10:46 PM In reply to

    • Mark Job
    • Not Ranked
    • Joined on Sun, Jan 23 2011
    • Montreal, Quebec, Canada
    • Posts 124
    • Points 1,495

    Re: MC5 Interface Settings Referendum - PLEASE PARTICIPATE!

    Larry Rubin:
    The negative effects on established workflows that some of these interface changes have generated have already resulted in some people getting those pink slips.
    …Hi Larry: Wow ! That's so not cool ! I use MC every day to make my living and when your mission critical tool gets messed with by a company who is all too willing to dictate to you that they know best, and "Hang on and enjoy the ride," then one desperately searches for alternative backup solutions. One cannot help but feel some external force is messing with their livelihood, therefore, survival instincts engage !Angry

    HP nw 9440 ISV Certified Workstation with nVidia Quaddro FX 1500 M w/512 MB of on board GDDR 3 RAM GPU, 2.16 GHz Core 2 Duo CPU, 100 GB 7200 RPM HDD, 4... [view my complete system specs]
  • Fri, Jan 28 2011 9:18 AM In reply to

    Re: MC5 interface settings gone?

    switthaus:

    Telegram!:
    Losing sight of this is losing touch with the original Avid experience and I hope it gets re-appreciated soon in upcoming editions.

    Do you really think new editors will have a change of experience?  I think not.  There is nothing for them to compare to, so they may well use Avid and it's new tools in ways that we "old" folks find uncomfortable.  I remember the first time I watched someone cut on Final Cut and thinking "what a terribly sloppy way to work" thinking that there was a total lack of "discipline" in the process compared to MC.  In time, I came to appreciate the way FCP editors worked and that freedom of workflow that I saw as "undisciplined".  Point is, that with a brand new editor on a new tool, there is no comparison to the "good old days" of MC4, so they will develop their skills, and be just as fast, with the tools that are provided to them.  There will be no muscle memory to re-train.

    Hi switthaus,

    Thanks for reminding me why I want Avid to succeed! 

    I was tooling around this site reading about Sundance after screening "A Life In A Day"--- all 90+ minutes temporarily simul-streamed on YouTube.... what a blast. It was an awesome editing job-- no matter what it was cut on.

    oops, I just googled it:

    http://www.postmagazine.com/Publications/Post-Magazine/2011/January-1-2011/Editing-Life-In-A-Day.aspx

    I also saw this-- http://www.studiodaily.com/main/technique/casestudies/12855.html an article about another Sundance film where the editor was so comfortable with Avid that she takes post-production out of the FCP realm... and for better or worse, her reactions to cutting on the new MC5 are in there too.

    To answer your question, no, I don't think new editors will have a change of experience... but for my sake, other loyalists, and everyone at Avid, I wish more editors will change back for all the right reasons.

     

    -Telegram!

     

  • Fri, Jan 28 2011 7:59 PM In reply to

    • alan wells
    • Not Ranked
    • Joined on Fri, Nov 4 2005
    • Aberdeen, Scotland
    • Posts 123
    • Points 2,025

    Re: MC5 interface settings gone?

    Well, that's a few spleens vented - but has anyone from the AVID hierarchy noticed?

    I wouldn't have expected a 'we feel your pain' statement, but surely a statement?

    I have avidly (no pun intended) read this thread but didn't feel the need to contribute, who cares about the 'Joe Soap' user anyway?

    As a Joe Soap user, it doesn't really matter to me whether something can be done in 2 keystrokes or 5 - I have all day to do it and all day to do it in. As a 'Silver Surfer', keyboard mapping is a a bit of a 'no, no'. By the time that I have reached the supermarket, I have forgotten what I am going there for!

    My needs will probably never be met:

    - an easier way to find the filter or effect that I want
    - background rendering such as we had in Liquid 7
    - a simpler clip logging system - I could go on.

    It strikes me that Media Composer, as an Apple and a Windows editor, is trying to 'be all things to all people' and is failing both; doesn't remove the filters and effects that have been around that the early day users have come to like; hasn't 'moved on'.

    I'd like to finish by saying 'That's my tuppence worth', but as you will learn (if you don't already know), tuppence buys nothing these days!

    Intel 2.5ghz Core 2 Quad Q9300 ASUS P5N32-E, 8gb RAM, Nvidia Quadro FX 3400 256mb PCI-E, Seagate 500gb drive, Seagate 160gb drive, Seagate 500gb drive... [view my complete system specs]
  • Fri, Jan 28 2011 8:04 PM In reply to

    Re: MC5 interface settings gone?

    Hi Alan,

    alan wells:
    ...has anyone from the AVID hierarchy noticed?  I wouldn't have expected a 'we feel your pain' statement, but surely a statement?

    Other than the ones from Todd Smelser at Avid?  Is it that you think Todd is not passing along the concerns of the forum, or that Todd isn't important enough?

    alan wells:
    doesn't remove the filters and effects that have been around that the early day users have come to like

    Why would they remove effects that people have come to like?  That makes no sense.

    ciao,
    Carl 

    Media Composer 2024.6 w/Symphony/SS/PF options, HP Z-Book G6 17", i7-9850H 2.60GHz, 64gb RAM, NVIDIA Quadro RTX 3000, Blackmagic UltraStudio Mini... [view my complete system specs]

    "There is hardly anything in the world that some man cannot make a little worse and sell a little cheaper, and the people who only consider the price are this man's lawful prey."  - John Ruskin (1819-1900)

     

    Carl Amoscato | Freelance Film & Video Editor | London, UK

  • Fri, Jan 28 2011 8:14 PM In reply to

    Re: MC5 interface settings gone?

    alan wells:
    as you will learn (if you don't already know), tuppence buys nothing these days!
    In reality tuppence was buying nothing a decade before the first line of code was written for the original Avid Stick out tongue

  • Fri, Jan 28 2011 8:37 PM In reply to

    • opie177
    • Not Ranked
    • Joined on Wed, Nov 18 2009
    • Chicago
    • Posts 72
    • Points 1,050

    Re: MC5 Interface Settings Referendum - PLEASE PARTICIPATE!

    Unlike some others, I have NOT had the time to read all 18 pages of posts here... but I get the idea. I was one of the users who did not update to V5 until the last 2 or 3 weeks, as I have been way too busy, and I like to give it some time before jumping into something like that. After I did the upgrade, I immediately sent a post about my issues and problems.

    All I really want now is the ability to go back to V4 until these issues get fixed... ("smart tool". advanced keyframes, and so on) but I cant find ayone who will tell me if this is possible or how to go about it.

    So... can anyone help me go back to v4?????

    HPZ820, 2.6GHz,32G, Win10, NitrisDX, MC12.6 [view my complete system specs]
  • Fri, Jan 28 2011 8:42 PM In reply to

    Re: MC5 Interface Settings Referendum - PLEASE PARTICIPATE!

    Hi,

    opie177:
    can anyone help me go back to v4?

    All you have to do is uninstall 5 and install 4.  If you don't still have the 4 install disks, you can download 4 from the download center.

    ciao,
    Carl

    p.s. If you're using software activation, don't forget to deactivate prior to uninstalling. 

    Media Composer 2024.6 w/Symphony/SS/PF options, HP Z-Book G6 17", i7-9850H 2.60GHz, 64gb RAM, NVIDIA Quadro RTX 3000, Blackmagic UltraStudio Mini... [view my complete system specs]

    "There is hardly anything in the world that some man cannot make a little worse and sell a little cheaper, and the people who only consider the price are this man's lawful prey."  - John Ruskin (1819-1900)

     

    Carl Amoscato | Freelance Film & Video Editor | London, UK

  • Fri, Jan 28 2011 8:49 PM In reply to

    • opie177
    • Not Ranked
    • Joined on Wed, Nov 18 2009
    • Chicago
    • Posts 72
    • Points 1,050

    Re: MC5 Interface Settings Referendum - PLEASE PARTICIPATE!

    I really dont WANT to... but I feel I may have to until a solution is offered! Just to keep my sanity.

    The real problem here is that these issues started months and months ago... and there is STILL no "fix" from them? I just dont know why it would take so long. Then again... I edit, not write code or program! So, what would I know!

    Thanks!!

    HPZ820, 2.6GHz,32G, Win10, NitrisDX, MC12.6 [view my complete system specs]
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