Hi all, looking for some good user end info on anyone using XDCAM HD, XDCAM EX and Media Composer Adrenaline.  We have the possibility of providing content to a network in HD and these are the two formats that we are thinking of using to acquire our footage.  XDCAM HD for the main camera, and XDCAM EX for the second unit for process days.  We are interested in the EX3, and either the 355 or 700 XDCAM HD models. 

We would Offline edit in SD on a LanShare EX with the lowres proxies or a SD down convert out of the XDCAM deck. 

Our Online would take place in a MCA, 2.8.3 or 3.0.  HP Xw8200.  Avid VideoRaid RTRX 10 drive model ultra 320 SCSI, 2 TB. 

We would have to deliver a SD master on Digi, which we already have a DVW-A500 to master SD to.  HD would be HDCAM, 1080i, 59.94, 4 channel mix, no DTS or 5.1.  The HDCAM deck that im looking at is a HDW-1800. 

I  am not looking to go to the new DX hardware now.  Budget isnt there.  Im getting a DNxHD Board and im looking at using DNxHD 220 for the online.

Any input on these models, pro’s con’s, decks, etc…. Workflows that you use, etc….

I have reps from Avid and Sony coming out to our facility in the next week or so to go over everything and develop a workflow, but I figured id ask here.  Thanks in advance kids!!

Jay

If you treat the XDCAM as tape based you will be fine. File based workflow has a lot of pitfalls. For example the low res proxy from XDCAM has low res audio also. This means you will need to recapture your audio.

DNxHD 220 is fine for online for TV broadcast. It is accepted by many channels including FOX (American Idol) and Discovery.

Adrenaline with the DNxCel card works ok. It can be sluggish and RT performance is minimal when compared to Symphony Nitris (classic) and DX hardware.

Dom Q. Silverio:

File based workflow has a lot of pitfalls. For example the low res proxy from XDCAM has low res audio also.

Yes there are pitfalls and probably more so on Mac based systems at present.

Times from an 11 disk project this week.  5 minutes to import the proxies from each 46 minute MPEG 50 SD Disk. And the capture is automatically subclipped for you. (Using PDW-U1)

30 minutes per disk to batch import all of those proxies at full res (if you want to).  This is obviously substantially quicker than capturing twice realtime (if offlining) AND quicker than capturing it all once, tape based style, at online quality.

Recapturing the audio from an audio only sequence is almost as fast as you can change disks. One more step for sure, however with this method you dont need to consolidate the timelines audio before making an OMF or AAF for audio post.

Andrew and Dom, thank you for your posts, very helpful.  We have the reps from Sony and Avid in house next week sometime to go over it all.  I heard that about the audio, that the low res proxie is low res audio.  We wouldhave to batch import an audio only timeline for the online, seeing audio post is done in Protools.  Thanks again!  Im looking forward to working with this stuff, looks and sounds so cool!

Jay

AndrewAction:

Times from an 11 disk project this week.  5 minutes to import the proxies from each 46 minute MPEG 50 SD Disk. And the capture is automatically subclipped for you.

For smaller projects I don't disagree that file based workflow is viable. For larger projects, I am still against it in general.

1. Fix compression. If you don't want to work in the given codec (low or high res version) you may be adding substantial processing time to your workflow.

2. Low res audio for proxy files. A lot of producers and EPs do not like the idea. They have been so used to better audio quality in the offline for so many years it is hard to convince them.

3. Software compatibility. If you are working in the native codec you may come across issues with older systems unable to work with it.

4. With P2 and SxS you have to factor in an archival infrastructure. Time and money.

5. Decks for playback. P2 and SxS HD decks.

For smaller projects there are ways around this list. For bigger projects it may not be efficient or even viable.

.02

Thanks Dom, for the SxS cards with the EX3, we were thinking of getting the USB / FireWire XDCAM HD portable drive that can connect to the camera.  When the cards were full, we would offload the material to a XDCAM disk.  That disk would then become the archive, basically like an old school beta sp tape. 

As for the Low res audio, yea, the feeling here between the editors is that it is not going to be enough for the rough cut.  The producers and especially the EP wants to hear good audio, thats what they are use too.  For this reason, we would probally do the SD downconvert for the offline.

Now, something that i was thinking about, and im wondering if it can be done.  What if i was to batch import the low res proxies, audio and video.  Then, go into the bin, and use the media tool to just delete the low res audio.  Could i then batch import the high res audio at 48k? for the offline?  Could this be done?  Sounds simple, but like i said, ive never used XDCAM HD or the new EX3.

Im just trying to wrap my head around this before Sony and Avid are here, so i can have some good questions and a possible workflow. 

Thanks guys!

jay

Dom Q. Silverio:

For smaller projects I don't disagree that file based workflow is viable. For larger projects, I am still against it in general.

For me file based from XDCAM disks answers most of my objections and speeds up my workflow.

With the PDW-U1 now able to copy files from EX3 (PC only at present I believe) to XDCAM disks SOME of my problems with card based systems have been dealt to. 

I am testing copying P2 to XDCAM disks this weekend but the worrkflow still involves a lot of time consuming extra steps.

Low res audio does not bother me and I usually upres my sequence's video and audio after a first pass rough cut.