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  • Wed, Mar 7 2018 1:16 AM

    • oze
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    When will MC finally get blending modes like other NLE's . . ?

    I've been working in Premier Pro and Resolve for a little while and came back to Avid for a project. The finishing part required adding some 4k Lens Distortions effects. Super easy to do in PP and Resolve. Can't do it in MC.  Why?  After searching the web, there don't seem to be any viable ways of doing it right in MC - except to buy Boris - but have you seen their prices!?

    Blend modes are SO basic. Why after 28 years are they still not included?  MC gets lots of dopey little upgrades but often seems to miss out on many of the important basics. It's tiresome . . .

    2017 27" iMac i7 4.2, 2TB PCI memory, 64GB RAM, OS 10.13.6, MC 2018.10 [view my complete system specs]
  • Thu, Mar 8 2018 4:12 PM In reply to

    Re: When will MC finally get blending modes like other NLE's . . ?

    To be honest apart from simple TV Post most people only use MC for offline work. Finishing in MC hasn't really moved along in decades. lots of people round trip to resolve and finish that way. A much cheaper option.

     

    ACI Moderator. I'm not employed by Avid or work for them. I just do this in my spare time. Normally using the current Media Composer version on My... [view my complete system specs]

     

    Broadcast & Post Production Consultant / Trainer  VET

     

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  • Fri, Mar 9 2018 12:30 AM In reply to

    • oze
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    Re: When will MC finally get blending modes like other NLE's . . ?

    I hear you Pat. But sometimes when your cutting off-line and you build some complex layered effects and titles etc, it's easy to simply relink to the graded material in MC and everything gets replaced really seamlessly in all the nested layers rather than having to recreate it again in another NLE. I like Resolve for grading. I'm not so sure about it as an NLE. I found aliasing issue on Resolve's 14.3's imported (alphas from AE) as well as generated titles and ended up compositing them over the shot in AE.

    When I cut high end TVC's that have effects  I just rough them out for approval and hand off an EDL/AAF to a Flame guy at an effects house and they take care of everything. But if it's a job that I'm shooting and producing myself, I don't often have the budget and that luxury. I have to do it all myself. I just noticed that MC is a bit backward in that one area that seems pretty simple. Even in the paint effects mode, there are some blending options but nothing additive like a "screen" blend mode. Seems like it would be simple enough.

    I'd also love to see a recent projects option on startup. How much time would it save if your in and out of multiple projects every day? Heaps! Anyway, I know I'm just bitchin'. I like the other NLE's but I still find MC the best to use overall. It's the one I use when a job is really important.

    2017 27" iMac i7 4.2, 2TB PCI memory, 64GB RAM, OS 10.13.6, MC 2018.10 [view my complete system specs]
  • Fri, Mar 9 2018 11:19 AM In reply to

    Re: When will MC finally get blending modes like other NLE's . . ?

    The issue for Avid is its not simple to add. The nature os the way Avid has been designed doesn't lend itself to supporting compositing beyond what we have. To make changes to allow it would be a mountain of work and I struggle to see ho backwards and forwards compatabilty could be maintained. 

    There are lots of things it would be great to have and I hope Vid find a way but for now we seem to get fixes and new additions that don't involve a compete re-write!

    ACI Moderator. I'm not employed by Avid or work for them. I just do this in my spare time. Normally using the current Media Composer version on My... [view my complete system specs]

     

    Broadcast & Post Production Consultant / Trainer  VET

     

    T 07581 201248 | E pat@vet.co.uk | W www.vet.co.uk |


    Media Composer V8.2 Review Background Render

    -

    Follow me on Twitter Pat_H_VET

  • Thu, Mar 22 2018 2:47 PM In reply to

    • buba
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    Re: When will MC finally get blending modes like other NLE's . . ?

    So then just add a plugin where people are able to add blend modes without having to change to the avid fx tool. Boris manages it so u cant??? Also there was the transfer plugin working for 32 bit machines- they were also able to create a plugin like that where you are able to use transfer modes just in avid- so you, AVID by yourself, cant manage this?!?!?! You are kidding me right? 

    Macbook Pro 2017 with Avid Standard Support Plan // www.faridmartin.de [view my complete system specs]
  • Thu, Mar 22 2018 11:12 PM In reply to

    • Bay7
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    Re: When will MC finally get blending modes like other NLE's . . ?

    Gotta agree with buba here.  This is one of those feature requests, like better color correction, that has been around for years... probably about 15 or so.  I think some of this reflects Avid's perception of what "offline" means.  Nowadays, sound mixing, color correction, VFX are all part of the process, even for offline.  I've cut in Avid for 25 years but sometimes I work in Premiere.  Man, Adobe is so far ahead in so many ways, ways that are very relevant to today's offline editors.  

    And of course if Boris can do it, Avid can do it too.  The "deep in the code" excuse is silly.

    Avid has made a lot of progress in the past few years.  Bravo for that.  But when you see the pace at which, for example, Resolve gets more and more capable with each release, you have to wonder what holds Avid back.

     

     

     

  • Fri, Mar 23 2018 12:46 AM In reply to

    Re: When will MC finally get blending modes like other NLE's . . ?

    Bay7:
    The "deep in the code" excuse is silly.
    Not at all. The way Avid deals with Video layers was hard coded into the earliest MC's.  V1 is seen as the lowest video layer no matter what order you arrange your video layers in the timeline.  This fundamental way of thinking gave Avid a significant advantage in the days of 16MB's of RAM no video card processing and processors not capable of unrendered real-time playback of 2 video layers (3:1 standard def.)

    Bay7:
    Resolve gets more and more capable with each release, you have to wonder what holds Avid back.
    For Avid the reasons like the one given above. Resolve on the other hand is a 3 or 4  year old NLE designed from scratch to work with and extend an existing Node based, 32 bit float media, timeline. First released long after video cards with GB's of RAM for specialised video processing had become the norm.  IMO it is really no wonder why Resolve can evolve faster. For me though they still cannot match Avid's reliable playback of full res media. (without (multiple?)expensive top of the line video cards. 

    FWIW looking at a Resolve HD timeline with playback (or output) running at 5 fps at present. (12 month old computer with a 1070 video card (8GB's RAM) Admittedly with resize, motion effects, and noise reduction.

  • Fri, Mar 23 2018 2:41 AM In reply to

    • Bay7
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    Re: When will MC finally get blending modes like other NLE's . . ?

    Thanks for responding Andrew.

    Of course the issue is deep in code -- that's true..  What's silly to me that this fact is used as an excuse not to have blending modes at all given that Boris can do it.  There's obviously a way around it, so why can't Avid use that way to give us these modes?  

     

    Re: Resolve.  Of course it is a newer program and that gives it an advantage.  Avid developed at a time when computers and their graphics were much less capable. (Ironically, if I understand correctly, these limitations led to the "bin as a separate file" structure, which to this day is one of the best Avid features.). But this begs the obvious question... why not rewrite to take more advantage of modern computers?  I know avid is doing some of this by offloading some tasks to GPUs.  But "it's an old program" is not a very convincing justification for lack of advancement  

     

    As far as Resolve playback is concerned, yes it does require a powerful computer for good playback especially with unrendered noise reduction.  But even with lesser comptuers playback can be greatly improved with features such as smart cache, optimized media, etc.  

     

    Believe me, I'm on Avid's side here.  But I work with a lot of younger editors and I can assure you, except when it comes to high-end features and most TV series, the future is not on Avid's side.  

     

  • Fri, Mar 23 2018 4:04 AM In reply to

    Re: When will MC finally get blending modes like other NLE's . . ?

    Bay7:
    given that Boris can do it.  There's obviously a way around it,
    Not obvious really. Yes Boris (and others) can do it. How? Boris (and others) treat each video layer (node) as a separate identity that can be arranged in any order the user chooses and all of their effects only apply to the layer they are applied to.
    Bay7:
    why can't Avid use that way to give us these modes?
    Because Avid's foundation is that V1 is the bottom layer and all FX work from the layer they are on downwards.l

    Bay7:
     But I work with a lot of younger editors and I can assure you, except when it comes to high-end features and most TV series, the future is not on Avid's side.  
    Nor was the past if you look at it from that point of view. Until Avid DV Avid had less than 2 percent of the NLE market (by systems in use).  Premiere had somewhere around 90%. Final Cut was around 5% (though most FC copies in use were either given away by Apple or pirated).  Zero! young people owned an Avid. (cheapest was around $35K then). Avid owners back then needed and expected to buy third party software for anything other than cuts, fades and BASIC titles editing. That was the foundation on which Avid software was built.

    This is why I have little problem looking to third party solutions, especially now Resolve and Fusion are so affordable, to meet any of Avid's shortfalls. Or why I do not get upset with no a lack of blending in MC.  I would MUCH rather they solved the play back stopping every time I look sideways at almost any other function during playback.

    Bay7:
    why not rewrite to take more advantage of modern computers?
    I am sure almost every MC user for the last two decades has wondered about this. Initially I had high hopes that MC | First  would be seen as an ideal opportunity to totally rewrite and test a new, modern video engine. 

  • Fri, Mar 23 2018 12:58 PM In reply to

    Re: When will MC finally get blending modes like other NLE's . . ?

    Pat Horridge:

    The issue for Avid is its not simple to add.

     

    How hard can it be if boris has had an effect that does it  for years?  They need to simply copy what boris amd saphire does but have it as a native effect. 

    I really cant think of a legit escuse. 

    iMAC (late 2015) 4GHZ i7 - 32GB RAM - AMD R9 M395X 4GB 512 SSD BOOT BM Ultra Studio Express w/Driver 10.5.4. [view my complete system specs]
  • Mon, Mar 26 2018 1:25 AM In reply to

    • Scotious
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    Re: When will MC finally get blending modes like other NLE's . . ?

    https://vimeo.com/73508571

    ...not just for transitions.

  • Mon, Mar 26 2018 1:40 AM In reply to

    Re: When will MC finally get blending modes like other NLE's . . ?

    That’s what I use now and yes it works fine but avid fx is no longer available for free and Boris red 5  is 600 $ and is no longer supported so it’s only a matter of time before it stopes working with software and os updates. There really is no other option for new users other than plunking down for Boris or sapphire which is crazy for such a simple effect. 

    iMAC (late 2015) 4GHZ i7 - 32GB RAM - AMD R9 M395X 4GB 512 SSD BOOT BM Ultra Studio Express w/Driver 10.5.4. [view my complete system specs]
  • Mon, Mar 26 2018 2:46 AM In reply to

    Re: When will MC finally get blending modes like other NLE's . . ?

    Robert Goodman :
    . There really is no other option for new users other than plunking down for Boris or sapphire
    Plonk down nothing for BM Fusion and nothing for BM's Edit Connection (basically an AVX effect very similar to Avid FX) Learning how to use it would take the same time (with an appropriate online tutorial) as watching the Avid FX tutorial referenced in this thread.  Once you find out how easy it is it is to use you will quickly discover blending is available in most effects, There is a great titling in Fusion. 3D Pan and Zoom options both with minimal learning curves.  IMO Fusion Free is Avid FX /Red 5.6 (and much more) on steroids

    Warning Edit Connection is not supposed to work with MC and Fusion Free.  However it works for very well for some and not others. For those it does not work properly for there is a quick, easy free workaround (Manually open Fusion and then open fusion effect file created from your timeline AVX). Or Fusion Studio (now at $300) with Edit Connection works as advertised. 

  • Mon, Mar 26 2018 4:58 PM In reply to

    • Marianna
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    Re: When will MC finally get blending modes like other NLE's . . ?

    Hey all......

    I pssed all this along to the product management team.   

    We do have plans to fix this in 2019 with the UI redo, but we are actively trying to get these in 2018 so it comes sooner than later.  We’ll see.. how the development progresses.  Regardless, its something we know we need to do.

    Marianna

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  • Tue, Mar 27 2018 1:54 AM In reply to

    • Bay7
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    Re: When will MC finally get blending modes like other NLE's . . ?

    Fusion should be an option, but I have never gotten Avid Connect to work properly.  And yes, I'm using the paid version of Fusion.  It more often than not crashes the avid, and even when it doesn't it often fails to create a comp file and NEVER opens Fusion, as it's supposed to.  Have you gotten it to work?  Is there a secret sauce?  It would be a great option if I only could get it to work.  

    Fusion has a nodal interface which is fine for me but puts some folks off.

    Thanks.

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