Latest post Mon, Sep 27 2010 6:59 PM by slabross. 7 replies.
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  • Fri, Aug 20 2010 8:59 AM

    • Indifilmz
    • Not Ranked
    • Joined on Sun, May 4 2008
    • Brisbane, Australia
    • Posts 19
    • Points 285

    suggestion on hardware set-up for all our AVID needs

    Hi there,

     

    I am not sure if I choose the right place to post this topic but I figure since our DS is the most relevant to get right at this stage, that getting feedback from those that are running DS would be the best. 

     

    OK, so we are very NEW to the DS. So new, that we are not yet officially installed and ready to go - maybe a day away from a perfect setup. As such, I am starting to wonder weather our hardware is best matched to all our software we are running.

     

    I should also point that that dollars are very limiting. We have spent well beyond what we initially thought we wanted to invest so getting this to work for time being (best it can) would be great, so we put a project or two through the machines.

     

    Currently, we have a Dual Booth xw8200 HP workstation with 4GB ram, fx3450 video card running XP 64 bit on one of the Drives and XP 32bit on the other. The workstation is connected to Nitris Classic as well as MediaDock U320 (12x 146GB striped in RAID 0 for 1.6T storage). 

    OK, now the xp64 has Avid DS 10.3.1 installed on it which was an upgrade from 8.4. We want to work with RED files and that is our priority, so we can on-line and color correct footage for indie projects shot on RED. The problem with installing the 10.3.1 is that the firmware was updated on Nitris Classic as it was installed not as a software only, but to use Nitris with it (I initially was meant to instal it as Software Only but made a mistake). Still currently in the process of getting the license sorted for DS 10.3.1

    The other drive (xp32bit) is running v3 Symphony, which not only is not going to work with DS 10.3.1 but is now not going to work with the firmware on the Nitris I just screwed up... hmm. 

     

    Then I have xw8400 HP workstation with 2x QC 2.67 X5355, 8GB of RAM, FX3500 video card running Windows 7 64bit with Media Composer v5 on it. It has a few HDD inside it but no connection to an external storage unit. 

    The MC set-up has worked fine with off-lining being its main job, which has been our business thus far. we invested into this 'older' unit to get the DS up to speed to do some color corrections and compositing.

    Now, we'd love to make the Symphony our main unit for off-lining over MC.

     

    I also got a Mac Pro (8core harpertown - 2.8ghz) with 6Gb of ram, with Nvidia GForce 8800T. ProTools runs on this which is an over-kill for ProTools.

    I also have a spare Quadro FX3500 which I could either put into the Xw8200 or into the Mac Pro if I needed to make MacPro qualify for any of the software.

    I certainly can run MC5 on the Mac Pro as I have tried that - it works like charm. 

     

    My MC and SN are dongle registered whilst DS is being run by a License (software).

     

    Do you think I should try and get the DS onto xw8400? 

    Should I run DS as software only and keep Symphony tied to BOB? 

    Should I try any of them on a Mac Pro? 

    Can I separate DS from Symphony - keeping one on the xw8200 and the other on xw8400? 

    Can I somehow get my two HP workstations to talk to each other - network? To share projects? 

     

    Any INFO would be much much much appreciated. 

    As I've said, we are about to settle on our license for DS as we initially were sent a License file as Software only and I just recently asked to get it to run with Nitiris classic... Maybe I need to ask back for License for software only?! 

     

    Thank You !

    Lav Bodnaruk

    Brisbane, Australia 

     

    Avid Symphony v4 & DS 10.3.1 running dual boot on xw8400 x5355 @ 2.66GHz HP workstation with Nitris Classic DNA BOB. Workstation has 8GB of RAM and... [view my complete system specs]

    Regards, Lav Bodnaruk http://www.lavproductions.com

  • Fri, Aug 20 2010 6:26 PM In reply to

    • slabross
    • Top 150 Contributor
    • Joined on Thu, Oct 13 2005
    • Montreal, Quebec, Canada
    • Posts 938
    • Points 9,690
    • Avid Employee
      Moderator: Avid DS

    Re: suggestion on hardware set-up for all our AVID needs

    Indifilmz:

    ... The other drive (xp32bit) is running v3 Symphony, which not only is not going to work with DS 10.3.1 but is now not going to work with the firmware on the Nitris I just screwed up... hmm.

    Fortunately, it is possible to reprogram the Nitris firmware to previous revisions, up to a certain limit. That limit was the RHoS implementation in the firmware around Avid DS v8.0 QFE 2. You don't specify your Symphony release but anything above v1.6.6 can have its Nitris hardware reprogrammed.

    Look for article 237611 in the Avid Knowledge Base.

    Indifilmz:

    Do you think I should try and get the DS onto xw8400?

    It is a more adequate and faster machine to run Avid DS compared to the outdated xw8200.

    Indifilmz:

    Should I run DS as software only and keep Symphony tied to BOB?

    It is not tested or approved to run Avid DS software on a Symphony workstation. I am not telling you that it won't work, just the official facts.

    Indifilmz:

    Should I try any of them on a Mac Pro?

    That is definitely not tested.

    Indifilmz:

    Can I separate DS from Symphony - keeping one on the xw8200 and the other on xw8400?

    Yes. Avid even ran a program allowing customers to perform this "system separation". It is indeed feasible. Your reseller might be able to help you, if needed.

    Sylvain Labrosse
    Principal Expert | Services and Customer Success

    Avid
    3510 St-Laurent Boulevard
    Montréal, QC H2X 2V2
    Canada
    sylvain.labrosse@avid.com

    Create cases online now at  csportal.avid.com 
    It's fast, easy and effective!

    We're Avid.  Learn more at www.avid.com  

  • Tue, Sep 7 2010 4:46 AM In reply to

    • Indifilmz
    • Not Ranked
    • Joined on Sun, May 4 2008
    • Brisbane, Australia
    • Posts 19
    • Points 285

    Re: suggestion on hardware set-up for all our AVID needs

    hi mate,

     

    thank you so much for your reply.

     

    I learned a lot from Avid in the recent weeks re: what I am actually getting under my assurance with DS, which changed a few of my plans. I am not attempting to move Nitris Classic to my xw8400 workstation as the only thing that i need to do. I will then run a dual boot (DS and Symphony) from that workstation. That is the only plan thus far. 

     

    Here are my current issues that I would LOVE to get some advice on please

     

    - xw8400 is missing an AVID Fan bracket used to cool the Nitiris cards down. Do I need these? My Avid Re-Seller said they cannot help... ?! Anyone got any ideas of what I could do? Should I try and run the Nitris Classic without the Fan brackets? How hot do they get? 

    - I just realised that my Avid MediaDock Ultra320 (12 bay) scsi storage unit is connected to the old xw8200 via its on-board Scsi connections... meaning, that since trying to move everything in xw8400 I need to buy a SCSI card that will enable me to connect to 2 of these Avid MediaDocks. 

    What SCSI card should I be getting? If I need to connect to 2 Avid MediaDocks

     

    Finally, is there much benefit of having 3 x 12bay Avid MediaDocks (each with 146gb drives in them) over 2 of them. 

     

    I Am going to stripe them all in RAID 0 and from DS Support page I am seeing that 24 drives (total of 2 mediadocks) in raid 0 is still only able to support 2K resolution with 1 video track... how do i get to play any higher resolutions? would connecting 3 mediadocks (and how to connect 3 media docks?) make it work with higher res videos? 

     

    Thank you!!

    Cheers

    Avid Symphony v4 & DS 10.3.1 running dual boot on xw8400 x5355 @ 2.66GHz HP workstation with Nitris Classic DNA BOB. Workstation has 8GB of RAM and... [view my complete system specs]

    Regards, Lav Bodnaruk http://www.lavproductions.com

  • Tue, Sep 7 2010 5:00 PM In reply to

    • slabross
    • Top 150 Contributor
    • Joined on Thu, Oct 13 2005
    • Montreal, Quebec, Canada
    • Posts 938
    • Points 9,690
    • Avid Employee
      Moderator: Avid DS

    Re: suggestion on hardware set-up for all our AVID needs

    Indifilmz:

     - xw8400 is missing an AVID Fan bracket used to cool the Nitiris cards down. Do I need these? My Avid Re-Seller said they cannot help... ?! Anyone got any ideas of what I could do? Should I try and run the Nitris Classic without the Fan brackets? How hot do they get?

    Avid was selling such a reworked fan kit made specifically for the xw8400 chassis but this workstation is no longer manufactured by HP nor shipped by Avid since a few years. We no longer have this part in stock. But you can take an actual fan kit and modify it so it fits inside the xw8400. It is feasible.

    Indifilmz:

    - I just realised that my Avid MediaDock Ultra320 (12 bay) scsi storage unit is connected to the old xw8200 via its on-board Scsi connections... meaning, that since trying to move everything in xw8400 I need to buy a SCSI card that will enable me to connect to 2 of these Avid MediaDocks. 

    What SCSI card should I be getting? If I need to connect to 2 Avid MediaDocks

    For the xw8400, we only tested and qualified the ATTO UL4D, which is a PCI-X card. The ATTO UL5D (PCI-express) is working but was too borderline for this system to properly support all formats, so I suggest that you don't use this card. It works well for other Avid products, and in newer systems, but not in the xw8400 for Avid DS.

    Indifilmz:

    Finally, is there much benefit of having 3 x 12bay Avid MediaDocks (each with 146gb drives in them) over 2 of them.

    I Am going to stripe them all in RAID 0 and from DS Support page I am seeing that 24 drives (total of 2 mediadocks) in raid 0 is still only able to support 2K resolution with 1 video track... how do i get to play any higher resolutions? would connecting 3 mediadocks (and how to connect 3 media docks?) make it work with higher res videos?

    Avid DS could support up to 3 MediaDock LVD (Ultra160) at some point in the past, but we never supported 3 MediaDock Ultra 320.  The maximum is 2 in dual-bus mode.

    2K is about the maximum that DS can play, and that is for preview because play back is not guaranteed and frames will be skipped at time (to maintain sync with audio). 2K media is meant for export to files and back to a film printer or some other output devices.

    Sylvain Labrosse
    Principal Expert | Services and Customer Success

    Avid
    3510 St-Laurent Boulevard
    Montréal, QC H2X 2V2
    Canada
    sylvain.labrosse@avid.com

    Create cases online now at  csportal.avid.com 
    It's fast, easy and effective!

    We're Avid.  Learn more at www.avid.com  

  • Fri, Sep 10 2010 5:15 AM In reply to

    • Indifilmz
    • Not Ranked
    • Joined on Sun, May 4 2008
    • Brisbane, Australia
    • Posts 19
    • Points 285

    Re: suggestion on hardware set-up for all our AVID needs

    Thank You! Very informative replies - I much appreciate it

     

    RE: the Fan Assembly, i have been able to modify the fan Assembly from xw8200 to fit into xw8400, but have since tracked down some other Avid users on the forum that are willing to part with their xw8400 fan assembly as they've moved onto Z series HP workstations with DX Symphony set-ups. Hopefully I can get it off them and therefore feel a bit easier about leaving the computer running without supervision (a bit sceptical about my current mod on the xw8200 fan assembly)

    A quick question that has me puzzled at the moment. 

    I've moved the dual turnkey into xw8400. Therefore, one of the drives is to boot the Symphony and the other is to boot DS. OK, so both of those drives need to be connected to the motherboard

    One of the drives (320GB SATA 7200rpm) that I am to use as the DS boot I plugged into blue SATA slot on the xw8400 motherboard. This makes sense as it is sequential from there on...

    The 2nd drive however (to boot Symphony) I plugged into SCSI SATA plug on the motherboard. This is where my OS drive was always plugged in, when I first bought xw8400. This particular drive is a 15,000rpm 300GB drive.

    NOW, when I start the machine with the key turned to DS - it all loads beautifully. When I start the machine with Symphony on, I get a warning message that says 1796 - SATA cable error. It goes on to suggest I should plug a drive into BLUE sata port first, then black ports. 

    Do you know how do I get around this message? 

    Thanks again for looking into this matter for me! 

    i feel I am moments away from booting both of the drives without mistakes, installing software and having a chance to do some actual work

    of course, when get DS installed I will have issues with licenses again but we are current with our assurance and Mike at Avid has been looking at this for us as soon as we are ready with it.

    Cheers!!!

    Lav

    Avid Symphony v4 & DS 10.3.1 running dual boot on xw8400 x5355 @ 2.66GHz HP workstation with Nitris Classic DNA BOB. Workstation has 8GB of RAM and... [view my complete system specs]

    Regards, Lav Bodnaruk http://www.lavproductions.com

  • Fri, Sep 10 2010 7:05 PM In reply to

    • slabross
    • Top 150 Contributor
    • Joined on Thu, Oct 13 2005
    • Montreal, Quebec, Canada
    • Posts 938
    • Points 9,690
    • Avid Employee
      Moderator: Avid DS

    Re: suggestion on hardware set-up for all our AVID needs

    You are looking for the dual boot system setup guide, and this is available on the Avid Knowledge Base:

    http://avid.force.com/pkb/LegacySearch?DocId=244491

    or the Avid DS Support Center:

    http://aviddssupport.avid.com/index.htm?section=documentation/online_library.htm&sub=guides/8.4.htm

    Sylvain Labrosse
    Principal Expert | Services and Customer Success

    Avid
    3510 St-Laurent Boulevard
    Montréal, QC H2X 2V2
    Canada
    sylvain.labrosse@avid.com

    Create cases online now at  csportal.avid.com 
    It's fast, easy and effective!

    We're Avid.  Learn more at www.avid.com  

  • Mon, Sep 27 2010 1:52 AM In reply to

    • Indifilmz
    • Not Ranked
    • Joined on Sun, May 4 2008
    • Brisbane, Australia
    • Posts 19
    • Points 285

    Re: suggestion on hardware set-up for all our AVID needs

    slabross:
    For the xw8400, we only tested and qualified the ATTO UL4D, which is a PCI-X card. The ATTO UL5D (PCI-express) is working but was too borderline for this system to properly support all formats, so I suggest that you don't use this card. It works well for other Avid products, and in newer systems, but not in the xw8400 for Avid DS.

     

    Hi Slabross,

    In the above stated, you mention that xw8400 does not support UL5D 100% on DS systems but can you please elaborate? I am hoping to get one of these cards, rather then the older UL4D merely because I want to upgrade the xw8400 to z800 in a near future (with the next job), so investing in older parts that won't work with newer machines isn't the best option. 

    If I was to get the Ul5D PCIe card, what won't it do on my current xw8400 set-up? 

    Thank You!

    Avid Symphony v4 & DS 10.3.1 running dual boot on xw8400 x5355 @ 2.66GHz HP workstation with Nitris Classic DNA BOB. Workstation has 8GB of RAM and... [view my complete system specs]

    Regards, Lav Bodnaruk http://www.lavproductions.com

  • Mon, Sep 27 2010 6:59 PM In reply to

    • slabross
    • Top 150 Contributor
    • Joined on Thu, Oct 13 2005
    • Montreal, Quebec, Canada
    • Posts 938
    • Points 9,690
    • Avid Employee
      Moderator: Avid DS

    Re: suggestion on hardware set-up for all our AVID needs

    The PCI-e structure of the 8400 does not provide the minimal required bandwidth to support all HD-RGB and higher resolution formats.  You can drop frames in capture and in playback or output.  It is a risk.

    The UL5D card works better in the 8600 and Z800 workstations in the faster PCI-e slots.

    If your work is mostly SD or HD (even DNxHD), then using the UL5D might be OK and indeed it is a piece of equipment that you can later transit (and save $$$) to the newer platform.

    Sylvain Labrosse
    Principal Expert | Services and Customer Success

    Avid
    3510 St-Laurent Boulevard
    Montréal, QC H2X 2V2
    Canada
    sylvain.labrosse@avid.com

    Create cases online now at  csportal.avid.com 
    It's fast, easy and effective!

    We're Avid.  Learn more at www.avid.com  

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