Please help me figure out which Quticktime codec to crunch Red files to.  I'm running MC version 3.1.3.

I am looking for a stable codec where the black levels, contrast and color will not shift on import/batch import to Avid.

The master files will be 1080 x 1920.  I may work at DV25 for offline and then uprez.  

ProRes is an option, but I have heard there is some problems when importing that into MC--and I think I've experienced those problems with the black levels.

How about Photo JPG, is there some other minimally compressed codec?

I do not have the option crunch to an Avid codec.

Any suggestions?  Any other insight into dealing with Red under these circumstances?

Thanks,

Paul b.

Paul, I believe the gamma at 1.8 may be the problem with Quicktime.  Snow Leopard will switch to a gamma of 2.2, which should help.

"... I do not have the option crunch to an Avid codec ..."

Why?  It would be more steamlined to use Avid's free MetaFuze, and convert the RED files to DNx, native to Avid.

 

BTW ... in about three months the "Star Stage" will be no more.  :(

 

 

Hi Randall,

No, I don't have that option--it needs to start out as a QT. Just trying to pick the right flavor.  

Is the 1.8 problem something happening across all codecs?   I don't even think I'll be on Leopard for this job--in Thailand.

 

I'll stop in an see you and have one last look at the Star Stage before the demolition.

 

Thanks,

Paul

Forgive me, but isn't a quicktime in the DNX codec will a quicktime? You can just download the codecs and folks can view and work with them just fine.

Or is there something that prevents that in your workflow like sharing those QT's to FCP for edit?

 

 

 

No,  DNX is a proprietary Avid format that can only be viewed on Avid.

You just need to download the free AvidCodecsLE installer and you can play/transcode to DNxHD on any mac from quicktime player or quicktime pro.

Since METAFuze is not available to run on Mac natively, which blows by the way Avid , the QT Pro method would seem to be the easiest and quickest method.  Have you tried REDCINE or REDrushes?  Do they not recognize DNX resolutions?

 

http://www.avid.com/red/

Thanks for the input so far.

I'm defiinitely NOT trying to interact with DNX resolutions directly from Red.  The masters have to be some form of Quicktime--for various reasons.  The DNX will be achieved by importing the 10 bit HD Quicktime files into the Avid project.  But I cannot start out with DNX transcoded directly from Red--not an option.

Anyone had any experience with ProRes HQ 10-bit? --great codec--but the issue is the black levels shifting.  Basically, I'm lookng for alternatives to ProRes.

Thanks,

Paul B.

REDrushes has more codec choices under DNX resolutions. REDCINE only offers the 10bit setting. In REDrushes you can export an ALE to track original .r3d files. REDCINE you can export an XML file and convert to an ALE. Both workflows should currently render faster than Metafuze 1.2. Hopefully will change greatly with Metafuze 1.3.

Just for clarification -

 

Quicktime is not a codec. Let's say that again, Quicktime is NOT a codec. And yes, DNX is ONE of the codecs that works with QT. No need to have an Avid to read them.

Think of Quicktime as a wrapper and the codec lives inside it so to say that a quicktime file that uses the DNX codec is not "a quicktime" is patently wrong.

Now, that said, there may be reasons to use another codec other than DNX, but let's be clear, DNX is a codec that can live inside a QT wrapper, just like h.264 or dvcprohd or pro res.

Now, why is DNX a bad choice for those quicktimes that you have to make? Let's talk about that. I'm curious because we're starting to do this out here and I wanna know why go with Pro Res over DNX, for instance? I have my reasons, what are yours?

Discussion?

 

 

Hi, good clarification.  I could use a little more.

Any time I've ever used or seen an DNX file it was in the Avid--an encrypted MXF or OMF file.  Different wrapper.

So you are saying I can make a Quicktime file with a DnX codec?  That might be great.

I want to import at low res and then batch import in HD--I don't want to mess around with transcoding MXF files.  That's why I am turning to file base.

I'll lose timecode and it will be time consuming.  No problem--I know.

 

paul b:

So you are saying I can make a Quicktime file with a DnX codec?

Yes, you can. It will give you Fast Import. All you need to do is install the Avid Codec: http://www.avid.com/dnxhd/ on any system that doesn't have Avid installed. Then, on those machines, in any application using the Quicktime engine, you can playback and encode DNxHD (or any other Avid codec for that matter). It includes the option of encoding into 10-bit Uncompressed HD, and that should still give you a (relatively) fast import.

paul b:

I don't want to mess around with transcoding MXF files.

What's so messy about that?

If you need two different resolutions (a full one and a low res one), you may either create these in an encoder, or, after importing the Hi-res version, use transcode to create a low-res version of those files. With the upcoming version of MetaFuze, allegedly, you should be able to create two different transcode (two different resolutions for instance) for each source. Then you can use Avid's link-by-resolution features rather than batch importing. MetaFuze runs on VMWare on the Mac.

That said: do some testing. From what I'm seeing, color space conversion is the tricky part in the equation.

We do this all of the time.  Use Red Rushes to make DNxHD 36 QTs for offline.  Then you can conform and re-process only the actualy RED files you need into DNxHD 175x or whatever.

Works like a charm.

 

I'm still looking for a good, simple tutorial/whitepaper on how QT and codecs interact. There's a ton of mis-information but yes, DNX QT's go into the Avid way quicker and play nice on any desktop with the Avid codecs installed.

Any more folks out there doing RED on Avid? Care to share your workflow?

In general, we have found that DNxHD codecs perform better color-wise than using Apple ProRes, so we have stuck with DNxHD as much as possible.