Thanks, Robert.

Would you happen to know anyone who's been using 3rd-party capture devices with MC?  I've heard for a few months that the Canopus device(s) work(s) but I'd like to hear from someone who's really using any product other than the Avid hardware.  It seems like everyone's too afraid to try it or maybe too afraid to admit they're doing it. 

I've used canopus for years for ingest on the road. Only for SD analog in but it works well. It was a staple for most 'Pro users early on.

smyers63:

Are you saying the BlackMagic devices work with MC or do you know?

I think I understand now and also understand where I misunderstood you before.  I thought that you were testing various 3rd Party devices for a new version to be released - this is what I took from "I am testing for Avid".  So, I was asking you if you had yet tested the BMD devices.  I did not realize that you were shooting in the dark just trying to get a 3rd Party device to work with a current version. 

The devices recommended here (and in previous threads) are, as far as I know, the best ones to work with currently shipping versions of MC software. 

Blkdog, I need input and possibly output for analog such as Y/C.  There are Canopus models which do that and are listed as compatible with Xpress Pro and/or Xpress DV.  That probably means that they'll work with MC but my goal is to try and find out with more certainty before buying.  I'm going to ask Canopus about compatibility with MC.  It's almost a sure thing that since they're FireWire they'll work but I'd like to know of any limitations.  The Avid compatibility list showed one Canopus model as qualified (I think it was the ADVC-100) but for output "Crash record" was listed as the only output option.  What does that mean?

Kenton, thanks for that reply.  It does appear you misunderstood and I didn't catch that earlier.  I'm sorry I misunderstood you, too.  While I am testing for Avid, it isn't quite as official as you must have thought.  I'm testing so that I can recommend what works for Liquid users who will take Avid up on the upgrade offer that's now on the table for a limited time.  Liquid users will have video cards and computers they've already spent a lot of money on and won't be able to spend more for Quadro cards and Mojos just to get a certified or qualified system.  That's why I'm testing the hardware I'm testing - so I can tell those Liquid users thinking about upgrading whether their systems have a chance of working correctly and what low-cost hardware they can use to save money.

It's possible that I can see something along the lines of the Canopus devices, whether that brand or another, at the Avid reseller where I bought Liquid and maybe try it with MC or another NLE there.

I've also thought about a cheap DV camera which can do a passthrough.  I don't know if there's a camera like that for the same price as the converters.  Does anyone have any ideas on that - if there's a DV camera on the market in the $200-$300 range that will do passthrough (input or input/output)?  I'm going to look around but any headstarts would be appreciated.

I've used a variery of DV cameras as transcoders in the past. I don't remember any of them being problematic really.

Also used a Canopus converter and a Miranda. Both seemed fine. The Miranda one did SDI and RS422 as well, but used to overheat and need switching off sometimes.

An analogue/DV50 converter would be great, but I've never heard of one. Seeing as Panasonic are the only ones who made use of DV50 in hardware, I guess it'd be up to them.

Although I think that the old Analogue Mojo is starting to show up for a good price second hard now that the DX line it out. They're great, of course.

Sure, the old model Mojo would be great but I think it's still probably out of the price range of a lot of the people I'm thinking of (and me, too).  Maybe I should check out the current prices on those just to see.

Since you mentioned RS-422, I know someone who's using BetaSP (analog component, 4:2:2, I think) and RS-422 deck control.  Is there something 3rd-party that would enable that for him using MC?  He's another of the Liquid mods with a copy of MC.  I think he'd be interested in knowing about it.  I'm pretty sure he'd want to take it in uncompressed instead of DV, so that might be harder to find or more expensive.  He's doing it now with Liquid and the Pro BOB.  That's a hard one to beat for the money.  I think the Liquid BOB if sold separately would be about $400 (that's the price difference between having it and not with Liquid).  If only it was a FireWire device instead of USB.  Or, if only MC could take input from a USB device.

I've heard of Miranda and looked at some of their stuff when I was looking for something else for a user.  I should take a look at them again.  Thanks for reminding me.

The boxes that include deck control are usually pricey.  The one advantage they have, is that the TC and Audio/Video signals stay in sync.  If you convert FW to analog, there will be a 1-2 frame delay on the Audio/Video signal.  Note, this only really matters if you are going to recapture or conform the project elsewhere.  However, if price is a primary consideration, then get either the Canopus or ADS converters, and use separate deck control.  Then, if needed, just inform the online editor to adjust the TC by 2 frames for the conform.  Avid includes an Increment/Decrement option in Clip > Modify Clip > Increment/Decrement Timecode.

BLKDOG:

I've used canopus for years for ingest on the road. Only for SD analog in but it works well. It was a staple for most 'Pro users early on.

 BLKDOG,

In the "Audio capture Problem" thread you mentioned:

"Yep, that's a nice little "Design" flaw in the software. Looping through a DV device to capture via FW will not pass audio through."

It gets me to wondering, are the Canopus/ADS Pyro boxes DV devices that also show this "design" flaw?  Probably I am getting my wires crossed here  .

Regards,

Douglas

BLKDOG, if you can respond to "are the Canopus/ADS Pyro boxes DV devices that also show this "design" flaw?", can you also specify if the problem is specific to Mac or PC.  I had heard Mac's might exhibit the problem, but not PC's.  This would be good to clarify.

For me, DV decks are pretty consistent on both Macs and PCs for this little "Feature". Canopus, however, seems to be fine on most PCs (but we;ve had reports of users having trouble on PCs too). Someone here once told me it had to do with the audio cards you run but I have yet to test that.

I used canpous converters most in the field with 'Pro. I have to admit that my only use for it with MC soft was a couple of jobs earlier this year. I don't think I've actually used it with 3.0 at all.

 Yesterday I had a need to try capturing some footage through my Sony HVR-M25 deck. I was feeding it an analogue signal.
I captured in MC3 and there was no sound captured!

When I get the time, I will try again with the workaround - putting the deck into record mode - and capturing.

Regards,

Douglas

Douglas,

One of the Canopus devices is on the qualified list.  There's one higher in the line which has some special A/V sync feature and a built-in TBC.  I'm confident that all the Canopus devices will work fine based upon what I've read from Canopus and the Avid device list.  I'm also confident that the ADS Pyro A/V Link will work.  That doesn't mean I don't want to hear that corroborated by someone who's actually used them, though!  That's where this thread comes in.

I'm trying to find one locally that I can either buy with a return priviliege or one that I can borrow to test for a few days.  They're hard to find as an off-the-shelf item as far as I can tell.  I have a call in to my local Avid dealer to see which converters they might have for sale or demo.  Ideally, I will be able to see one hooked up to MC and test input and output before leaving the dealer.  We'll see.

On the subject of cameras for passthrough, that isn't my preferred option.  I looked tonight at what's typically sold now and none had FireWire connections.  All of them which had a computer connection had USB.  So, it will mean more work possibly for nothing to find a camera currently on the market at a comparable price to the converters which has a FireWire connection.  If a camera isn't going to pass audio in one direction or the other or both, it would be a waste of time to research the models with FireWire.  I'm glad the point about audio was brought up because it reinforces my decision not to use a camera for this purpose.

Hi,

can anyone reccomend an analog capture system.  I have alot of analog stuff that I need to capture (basically want to use my Avid as an expensive vhs to dvd converter).  With my old Xpress pro I could capture analog through my deck no problem.. but not with MC.  :(   I do know about the workaround of putting the deck into record while I capture to get the audio, but I have long tapes to bring in (longer than 1 hour).  I know the Mojo is the device to do it but these are just my home movies and the mojo is overkill.  Can anyone confirm an analog converter that works with 3.0 (and brings in audio too).  I was looking at the ADS DVD Xpress DX2.. seems interesteing.  Might be a time saver (no need to go to squeeze to make the MPEG2 files).  Only thing is that I would prefer an avid solution so I still have the ability to make edits to the stuff I bring in.

http://www.adstech.com/products/USBAV-709-EF/intro/USBAV-709_intro.asp?pid=USBAV-709-EF

I also just had another thought...  I have a pinnacle HD PRO stick and I think it might have analog input capabilities.  Also I saw they sell a PCI tv tuner card with analog inputs too.  That might be a cool product to have... but might it conflict with Media Composer?

http://www.pinnaclesys.com/PublicSite/us/Products/Consumer+Products/PCTV+Tuners/PCTV+Digital+PVR+(DVB-S_DVB-T)/PCTV+HD+Card.htm

I think someone said you could use windows movie maker to get the footage into the computer.  Does it capture with an avid codec (so getting the footage into avid doesn't take forever).

Alot of different products out there..

thanks alot,

-Peter B

MC isn't going to capture directly from any USB device.  You could capture with basically anything, then export and import but that takes extra time and hard drive space.  At the moment, that's what I'm doing.  I'm capturing with Liquid Pro, then fusing (a special form of fast export) and then importing to MC.

The Canopus ADVC-300 is probably the most-recommended 3rd-party device.  I've heard nothing but good about it and that it does work with MC.  I have one on the way pretty cheap.

We have the old mojo's for all of our systems, but I also carry a ADVC 300 in my car for when I need a quick edit session in the field onto MC on my laptop.  It works very well, and gives you component output in addition to composite and s-video.  The only thing that I don't like is that once you capture and start playing back from the timeline, it automatically switches transcoding modes back to the Avid laptop as a source instead of keeping the deck as the input source.  And in the same bag is a USB-422 converter from addenda that works very well for deck control.