From the Avid / NLE point of view, there's nothing to gain from vista, but a lot to loose. Unless you really have to use vista, e.g. because your laptop only came with vista drivers, xp professional is the safer choice. it's stable and performant (as far as you could ever say that about any m$ os), and although it has it's fair share of annoying bugs and "features", at least they are well known and dealt with.

Anyway there's that old saying: never change a running system!

 Let me give you the best reason to upgrade to Vista: Vista 64.  If your machine is stocked with 4GB or more, that gives the application more virtual address space to work with, without paging, which means better performance.

In XP 32, the application is limited to 2GB of virtual address space, by default.  We include the Add3GB utility to increase this limitation, I think up to 2.7GB.  In Vista 64, every 32 bit process (which MC 3.0 is one of) is allowed 4GB of virtual address space.

There is a slight performance hit when running a 32 bit application in Vista 64, since it has to go through a thunking layer.

My final recommendation is if your XP 32 system is running fine, with the performance levels and stability you can accept, then just let it be.  If you need the extra address space because you need to have lots of bins with lots of complex sequences open, or you have memory intensive AVX effects, then consider Vista 64.

Ok, so that wasn't my final recommendation... this is my personal and real final recommendation for this post: Don't do an upgrade install of Vista, choose a clean install, after backing everything up first.

 

 

Brian,

 

Does render acceleration work with approved quatro cards in Vista Business 64 as it does in XP Pro with MC 3?

 

Thanks

 

Atomike:

I have not used Vista with AVID, so I cannot say anything about that. However, Vista is a fine OS. It's more secure than XP, and has many features you'll like.

For those having problems with Vista - Vista has a way to see exactly what is causing your problems. Go check that out - and learn that Vista is not the problem, but in fact, it's your third party drivers and software. Just because third parties are too lazy to update to a 2 year old OS does not make Vista bad - it makes your third party apps bad.

The real tech-y guys, like Leo Laporte, are now just laughing at all the Vista hate - since there's no rational reason for it. If software and hardware companies refuse to write drivers for Vista, what can Microsoft do? How is it their fault? When you hear the Vista hate, just sit back, laugh, and wish folks well with their vacuum tubes. Don't fear technology. Don't be afraid to be moderately current.

 

 

 

I have to agree with you Atomike. I have had nothing but great experiences with vista. I am currently running MC 3.0 with Vista 64 and I am stunned at how well it runs. I have yet to have any bus errors, crashes, anything. I installed a duel boot on my machine by way of a second HD and originally planned to slowly come up to speed on Vista. I like others thought that I would have to find fixes for drivers, bugs, and other annoyances that come with using a new untested OS. Now I am seriously considering scraping my Windows XP partition and going straight to Vista. My only problems at present is that Sonic DVD does not work on Vista 64 and I think one Trapcode plug-in does not work as well. However I just got Adobe CS3 production Suite and as soon as I learn Encore DVD my edit system should be fully functional. AS for vistagoes, my only problem as far as installation has been finding a driver for my M-Audio Card. So far there isn’t one for 64 bit Vista or Xp as of yet. Not Vista’s fault by the way. People having problems installing Vista on older systems or home built system should research and download the proper third party drivers for their hardware first, including the chipset hardware and devices on your motherboard!  Most people having problems with vista always make this mistake. Well anyway I have to get back to outputting several DVCPro HD Programs on my MC 3.0 system, running on VISTA64, running like gang busters. That’s right, I said gang busters.

BLKDOG:

Atomike:

learn that Vista is not the problem, but in fact, it's your third party drivers and software.

I love quotes like that. "Vista is a fine OS...as long as you buy all new software for it". Man if Avid did that, the screaming would be heard for miles.

Like I said, there's no rational reason for the Vista hate.

Software compaines know they must occasionally update their software for new operating systems. Every OS has backward compatibility issues. To blame Vista for this reason belies an ignorance of other operating systems, and - frankly - basic computer history.

Also, AVID does this all the time (in a slighly different way). - or haven't you noticed that hardware requirements have changed at least once in the Media Composer product line? You analogy is fine, but it proves MY point.

Yeah, that's my point. You guys scream and yell when Avid does this but when a new OS can't run apps and drivers you've come to know and love, then that's not poor Microsoft's fault....

Meanwhile, if Avid were to release a version of their software that eliminates support for even a third party plug-in, folks are screaming bloody murder.

 

Brian Williams:

My final recommendation is if your XP 32 system is running fine, with the performance levels and stability you can accept, then just let it be.  If you need the extra address space because you need to have lots of bins with lots of complex sequences open, or you have memory intensive AVX effects, then consider Vista 64.

Ok, so that wasn't my final recommendation... this is my personal and real final recommendation for this post: Don't do an upgrade install of Vista, choose a clean install, after backing everything up first.

 ...OK Brian. I got a few warnings that I was running out of memmory running MC 3.0 and I never received this warning before. (??) Is MC 3.0 more memmory intensive than 2.8.3 ? I have 4 GB of Ram installed. I was wondering if going up to Vista 64 bit with my HP nw 9440 would solve this issue, since I would then have a full 4 GB available in my machine to address to Avid.

 

To clarify I think it's fair to say that Vista is not as bad if you have a very robust computer.  Vista is resource intenstive.  If you have a 64 bit processor with at least 4gb of ram and newer powerfull graphics card or better yet 2 cards hooked up SLI then you won't have as many problems.  If you are running on an older pc or a laptop that has a single core proc and limtited to 2gb of ram then it will be more painfull.

 I always laugh when I see someone point out that Vista is more secure. My editing system isn't hooked up to the internet. You can't get much more secure than that.

I bought an hp dv2500 laptop and upped the RAM to 2Gig. It came with Vist Home Premium. It hangs up from "hibernate" or "sleep".  Anytime Internet Explorer stops responding the task manager is useless, "Cant establish security whatever". I upped the OS to Vista Ultimate and it isn't any better.

Every story I have heard says Vista is great on a top notch machine. Just don't try running it on anything less.

BLKDOG:

Atomike:

learn that Vista is not the problem, but in fact, it's your third party drivers and software.

I love quotes like that. "Vista is a fine OS...as long as you buy all new software for it". Man if Avid did that, the screaming would be heard for miles.

 

 

 Blkdog I love ya but we need to take a trip down memory lane, to a simpler time around 2001. Apple had just introduced a new OS for their computers called OSX with the aqua interface no less. It was a great looking OS. Sure at the time it could only run on certain systems but it was new. I should also point out that absolutely nothing ran on it! I remember going to a still in business Comp USA and taking a look at a demo being given by an Apple rep. On the dock he had displayed Photoshop, After Effects, FCP and several other popular Apps of the day. I asked if I could see Photoshop in OSX and he proceed to launch it. That’s when I noticed that it launched OS9 first.

I remember asking the Apple rep “why is it launching OS9?”

            To which he replied “Because none of these programs currently work in OSX yet. In fact we recommend that you boot directly in OS9 if you intend to use After Effects or FCP.” He said this while smiling like a good sales person should.

            Then I asked “Well are there some major apps that do support OSX?”

            He answered and I quote “No. Third party developers are currently developing drivers and support for some popular applications. You should see popular application support around the middle if not the end of next year. However Quark Xpress should be out by the end of the year. The new I life package currently supports the new OS and you get it free with purchase.” He’s still smiling by the way.

            “So I should see you guys in a year and a half” I say, and leave. About a week later a coworker of my came to work all excited. He had just purchased a copy of OSX. So we slapped it on the newest G4 we had and it sat there looking pretty for about a year and a half.

The point is people were patient with OSX. “It’s a brand new OS why should it be compatible with old non Unix based software. Apple should be applauded for trying to drive the industry forward by making vendors write new code to support its new OS.”

            If Microsoft handled vista the way Apple handles OSX people would burn Bill Gates in effigy. Could you imagine if Vista launched with no support for anything that came before it? If you needed to use older software or hardware you had to run Windows XP in the background.

            Criticize Vista because it does have its problems, too many versions, too much bloat ware when shipped with vendor systems, elevated hardware requirements just to present the interface to name a few. However blame the third party developers for the things they are responsible for as well. I need a 64 bit driver to run my M-audio card and currently there isn’t one but there are at least 10 different versions of OSX drivers including the point updates.

            I’m just saying, Criticize but be fair about it. Afford Vista the same patience you gave OSX when it launched all those years ago. It is a great OS and it will impress you if you give it a chance.

 

dexter2999:

Every story I have heard says Vista is great on a top notch machine. Just don't try running it on anything less.

 ...As my system specs point out I have an Intel Core 2 Duo processor with an L2 cache of 4MB and four GB of RAM. Aren't the Core 2 Duo line of Processors supposed to be 64 bit OS ready ? My Graphics card is the Nvidia FX 1500 M with 512 Megs of Ram. Does this system spec meet Vista requirements ? I know my laptop is Avid certified to work with MC and ASTK ver 5.7.

 

Doc, you're completely missing my point. I'm not saying that Vista is any better or worse than any other OS. 

All I'm saying is I wish folks would be as tolerant of Avid's changes as they are of Vista and (Now that you brought it up) OSX.

BLKDOG:

All I'm saying is I wish folks would be as tolerant of Avid's changes as they are of Vista and (Now that you brought it up) OSX.

Yeah, how come 3.0 won't run on a 68K Mac, since 5.5 did?

(ducking and running that-a-way)--->

BLKDOG:

All I'm saying is I wish folks would be as tolerant of Avid's changes as they are of Vista and (Now that you brought it up) OSX.

Your point is accurate man - people put up with anything from Apple or Microsoft while constantly bashing Avid.  I think this has to do with marketing...when people idolize something they forgive anything.  It's just like the hot chick a guy puts up with that has serious issues...but she's hot so all is forgiven. Avid needs to be hot again.  They need to continue what they are doing and market like Microsoft and Apple.

I heard Lucas speak at Fox a couple years ago, and he mentioned he's working or wanting to work on a new NLE that is more intuitive or something like that.  If and when he does that....wow...that would revolutionize things.  Products like Adobe Premiere would definitely be gone forever.  It would be kind of like Microsoft stepping in with their first X-box - serious cash would leave other NLEs.

Current gaming benchmarks show that Vista runs about 4 or 5 percent slower than XP in games (I dont' know about AVID). These benchmarks are based on stats at several computer magazine and podcasts - basically anyone current with PC news.

Contrary to some posts, you don't need a top of the line machine to run Vista. If you've purchased your machine in the last 3 years, you'll be just fine. To say you need a top-of-the-line machine to run Vista well is simply factually wrong. I don't want to sound patronizing, but I simply have to wonder where some folks here get their information.

 

Also: Blkdog - I think I understand your position better now, and I agree that AVID often gets needlessly bashed for compatibility. I've done it myself - but now I must give them MUCH credit for working with Vista. Good for them.