If we have media captured through an Avid app is ok.

But what if someone brings us something captured within Premiere or FCP or anything like QT or avi?

Then it's 1:1? Or almost?

Those are no smart questions Carl. Only to know what to expect and how to handle.

Hi George,

Yes, if someone brings you a file that hasn't been created using an Avid codec*, it can take a long time to import it.  I don't know the exact time required, but in my experience the faster the computer processor, the faster the importing (video card and amount of RAM make little difference).

good luck,
Carl

*Almost nobody creates files with the Avid codec, unless you have contact with the graphics person from the beginning.

camoscato:

The answer is the same as it was at the beginning of this thread.  The only way to ensure fast importing is to create files using an Avid codec.  A fast processor helps, but nothing helps as  much as using an Avid codec.

These were not the droids I was looking for!

I'm hoping that when they were working on MC 3, the engineers lifted the import code out of Liquid! I'm going to have to see if I can transcode using QT Pro into an Avid CODEC, and see if it isn't faster. If that works, then it's a very inexpensive work-around.

"Liquid users are used to being able to import hour+ long videos in under 5 seconds ..."

I'm not familiar with Liquid, so bear with me and/or enlighten me.  If you're accessig the source media in 5 seconds, is it 1)linking to the source media, or 2)actually Importing it, e.g., creating new media files in Liquid's format?

Media Composer, Symphony Nitris, etc., do not link to the source files.  It reads the source files, and then creates new media from them, hence the time requirement.

DStone:

I'm going to have to see if I can transcode using QT Pro into an Avid CODEC, and see if it isn't faster. If that works, then it's a very inexpensive work-around.

It WILL work, Dave...the question will be whether it is faster to convert and then import vs. just import.  If it's a one-time thing, I might consider just importing.  But if there is the possibility of re-importing (either down the road or for finishing a project) I might take the time to make the Avid QTs.  You can always save those Avid QTs and then in the future, the imports will be much faster.

Well, I did the testing. And it's no faster to go to Avid DV via QT Pro then it is to import directly into MC. I also managed to finally get export to Avid DV working in Liquid. But that's a lot slower (approximately 8:1 on my system). I wonder what all of this looks like on a current (read: reasonably fast) system.

I think I'm going to have to recommend using QT Pro and setting up batch jobs for converting existing files. As Kevin said, this way the files are available for re-import at speed later on as well.

sverkalo:

Don't you think it should be faster?

This is a fundamental difference in the way Avid Xpress/MC handles media (compared to FCP and various others).

Avid (by which I mean the Xpress, Media Composer and Symphony products) maintains very tightly controlled. All media in Avid has to be in a specific Avid codec or supported third-party codec (P2 DVCPRO HD for example). This tight format control allows for more consistent realtime performance and better multi-stream performance.

Also, but keeping all the media in specific locations and indexing it Avid offers unmatched media management (which becomes really invaluable on larger projects and for offline/online workflows).

I am constantly frustrated in FCP by the fact that media easily becomes 'offline' when it is moved in the system or when the drive it is on is unavailable. Specifically, we do a lot of motion graphics work. all the finished renders end up on a central network drive, but if I import directly from there with FCP I can't play properly, and it goes offline if there are any network permission issues or if the drive is unmounted. I have to copy all those files to a local drive before I import them and then I have to keep track of them to make sure I have the right version. In Avid, with the same files, I import, the file is converted to Avid media and copied to a local media drive. It always plays just like any other media and works regardless of the network connection - if the file is updated I can simple Batch Import to replace it from the source and all my edits are updated with new media.

I used to hate the import time in Avid, but now I'm much more frustrated by the 'linking' methods in FCP and others, where I spend a lot more time managing the files mysel.

If someone gives you a finished program as an AVI or QT file then sometimes it might be more efficient to convert it with another application (Sorenson Squeeze for example) before importing it. Also, AVI isn't as well supported as Quicktime.

 Dave and Sverkalo,

4 months ago I was in the same boat and thinking the same way as you are now:

How well and easily will I be able to get my work from Liquid to import into MC?

I envisaged a scenario where I would be using my friendly Liquid to do much of my work and using the new unknown MC to start other projects. Maybe even hoping to switch between the two.

In my case (not necessarily anyone else's case) I imported 5 files from my Liquid projects.
After that (about 2 weeks later) I have never ever felt the need to import anything from my old Liquid projects.
Also I have only opened Liquid 3 times since then, and that was to get some Camtasia footage to use in my tutorials about the migration from Liquid to MC.

I teach English here in Japan. One of the cardinal rules I insist on in my classes is that my students must use English ONLY in the classroom. Trying to use English and Japanese slows the learning process.
The same applies to learning MC. Don't try and Mix Liquid language with MC language.
It will slow you down and restrict you.

I think you have to accept the fact that you will have to abandon Liquid at some point in the future.
The sooner you can do that - the faster you will get up to full speed with MC.

After almost 4 months I am still trying to use some Liquid techniques and concepts in MC - but recently I feel I am really picking things up more and more.

Regards,

Douglas

For me it's an annoyance issue, nothing more. I've got a lot of media that will get re-used, so I need it available. Hence my decision to use QT Pro and batch up the files. I don't need it all right away, so there's plenty of nights where the systems are unused and can render away. I'm not going to have any problems editing in MC once I learn where everything is (right now I have to search for things). Nor do I have a problem with keyboard centric applications (you really ought to try and use Blender some time; keep one hand on the keyboard and the other on the mouse).

Actually, in thinking about it, I could also just move all the files into one directory and tell MC to import them all into a blank project...

Douglas I agree with what you said but importing big files taking so long it's not so god thing sometimes. It can slow you down. This has nothing to do with the fact that MC is doing that for the better if not the best media mangement. This seems awesome because as I discovered you just need 2 folders to go and running in no time in a laptop or another desktop. We just say that the import could be faster and in fact a lot faster that's all.

sverkalo:

We just say that the import could be faster and in fact a lot faster that's all.

While Avid is reliant on using it's own media formats rather than supporting any QT or AVI codec then I don't think the import can be much faster. It is essentially, I believe, using Quicktime native conversion tools to convert the media into an Avid Codec, that conversion is going to take time no matter what. This is evidenced by the fact you experience a significant wait in exporting as Avid-native Quicktime from Liquid (which is just shifting the work to the other end of the chain really).

In many cases, depending on the footage, it might actually be quicker to put the footage on tape and recapture - one advantage of that method is that you will have a tape to fall back on if you need to later (especially handy with commonly used elements that you're going to need often).