Blitzer:

The MC3 and hardware announcements did not even make a ripple in the other NLE forums on Creative Cow or on LAFCPUG.  That would worry me if MC was my product.  You'd at least think some of the Edit* crowd would be talking about Avid at this point.

This is a great point that has also been bothering me lately.  I use Avid, I think it's great, and it drives me crazy when I see all the user generated support (add-ons, plug-ins, macros, etc.) that are available for FCP via external communities.

  And at the same time, this "huge" new announcement from Avid makes NO waves in communities outside this forum. Nothing I have seen, outside of just repeting the same press release... of course that could also say something about the average Avid user.

  If someone else has seen waves, please link us.

Why should it make a wave?

Those days are gone, even the FCP wave has gone.

80% of FCP and Adobe users will have no need to switch A LOT of editing taking place is not craft editing it is just plonking shots down on the timeline it is not even editing in the true sense, people doing that kind of work do not need to change to Avid.

Avid have to aim at craft editors who know that 1 frame makes a difference and who's career is based on craft skill and working pressures and who know what a 20hr edit session feels like.

If 80% is the case, and 20% would be potential new customers for Avid, I'd think Avid should find it very interesting - especially as a certain percentage of those will in time be large budget Avid customers.

And if Avid aims at craft editors "who know that 1 frame makes a difference", it would be good for it to know that there are small budget editors or editors in the beginning of their "craft" who know this too.

NICKB:

80% of FCP and Adobe users will have no need to switch A LOT of editing taking place is not craft editing it is just plonking shots down on the timeline it is not even editing in the true sense, people doing that kind of work do not need to change to Avid.

 

Avid have to aim at craft editors who know that 1 frame makes a difference and who's career is based on craft skill and working pressures and who know what a 20hr edit session feels like.

Thanks for clearing that up.  I'm just glad I'm a Craft Editor and not a Plonker (because I use Avid!).  

 <--- Happy to be a plonker - 'cause those jobs pay for the craft work.

Of course, you can be a crafty plonker . .

It is all a mindset thing, think positive and anything is possible.

IF you really really want a full spec Avid DX Nitris system you will find a way of being able to buy it,   it costs no more than a car and a lot less than a house and there are millions of them on the planet.

 For those of you in and around the Washington DC area, Avid is having a big demonstration of all the new Nitris DX and Mojo DX hardware and new Media Composer software version to get hands on with on Wednesday June 4th, 6:30 PM to 9:30 PM at the Ronald Reagan International Center, 1300 Pennsylvania Ave, NW, Rotunda Room. Come see it in action. But take the Metro, unless you want to pay $25.00 or more to park.

NICKB:

It is all a mindset thing, think positive and anything is possible.

IF you really really want a full spec Avid DX Nitris system you will find a way of being able to buy it,   it costs no more than a car and a lot less than a house and there are millions of them on the planet.

Fair enough, Nick.  I'll see you at the next Tony Robbins seminar.  

Larry Rubin:

But take the Metro, unless you want to pay $25.00 or more to park.

What's $25 to an Avid owner!  :)

The Chicago demo is Thursday, but I'll be finishing a job.  Gotta make money to spend it...

Blitzer:

Larry Rubin:

But take the Metro, unless you want to pay $25.00 or more to park.

 

What's $25 to an Avid owner!  :)

Good point.  Avid owners with a Nitris DX should be able to pay that back in less than an hour.

Blitzer:

MC is definitely worth the cost, and I make a good living using it.  However, unnecessarily high pricing can create resentment instead of loyalty.  Additionally, it keeps people looking over at the grass on the other side of the fence.

     The problem here, and with several folks posting in this thread, is the assumption that Avid is gouging. Without knowing what it really costs them to make a Mojo DX, you shouldn't make assumptions about their pricing scheme.

     Would Blackmagic make it a lot cheaper? Yes. Does Blackmagic hold to the level of technical quality that Avid does? Not in my experience. Would Blackmagic answer the phone and solve your problems? Not in my experience. Does Blackmagic have a fraction of the overhead Avid does? No. And I won't even talk about the lousy break out cables that Blackmagic provides to connect to their cards...

     When Avid sells through a reseller, I'm going to assume a normal markup and say the reseller is paying $3,750 for that $7,500 box. What does it cost Avid to get that box out the door. Including not just manufacture and packaging, but marketing, R&D, support, make goods on bad boxes, etc.

     Personally I don't feel Avid is gouging anymore. If the Value to cost ratio isn't good for you, move along. But don't assume it is because Avid is screwing you.

    As for Avid opening up to using third party cards in the future, they already do that now. They use AJA cards in DS to get 4:4:4 and they use the power on the GPU cards to get more performance. It isn't too much of a stretch to figure out where things are going in the future. (Not speculating here)

 Personally, I don't own a car. People I know who do own one and are editors, well, let's just say it's not a Mercedes. The problem with Avid for students is that they also use their computer for other stuff and Avid does not like that at all. When I mention such things in the forums I usually get berated. Ha, the silly newcomer surfing the new on his computer, ha, using MSN Messenger, silly little goose. Go play with your Premiere, boy.

BTW, Avid Free and definitely Avid Pro are NOT a strong solution as they offer little in the way of finishing a complete process as is needed by students who need to submit movies as homework, upload them to the Internet, send them to competitions, burn them to DVD, etc. Any student would also consider from time to time to rent an HDV camera, and a lot (I did) are considering owning one as the cost of one is less than Avid+Hardware. Sure, these cameras are low end and have strange PAL formats at the time, but who needs to support that. Let them boil for three years and then charge them for the upgrade.

amitzinman:

The problem with Avid for students is that they also use their computer for other stuff and Avid does not like that at all. When I mention such things in the forums I usually get berated. Ha, the silly newcomer surfing the new on his computer, ha, using MSN Messenger, silly little goose. Go play with your Premiere, boy.

BTW, Avid Free and definitely Avid Pro are NOT a strong solution as they offer little in the way of finishing a complete process as is needed by students who need to submit movies as homework, upload them to the Internet, send them to competitions, burn them to DVD, etc.

i use my laptop for Everything.  Media Composer, emails, spreadsheets, IM, surfing the web, etc.  i just know not to be a dummy to risk my life-blood and click on "free webcam girl" banners.  (that's what the home desktop is for ; )  )  and i have no problems running Avid.  in fact, i decided i was going to purposly crash my Avid - so i ran iTunes, AOL and downloaded a 500mb file over wireless off my neighbor's one-bar 11mb connection while i cut HDV off my single internal HD.  no problems.  I have the right gear.

Student pricing is a steal.  in fact, the regular pricing is a steal.  just take a look at the cost of the 3rd party software bundled -

DVDit "ProHD"  $300

SmartSound SonicFire $100

Sorenson Squeeze 5 $500

Boris Continuum Complete (v5 on the website) $1,995

So commercial users are getting $2,900 worth of 3rd party stuff for free.  Avid likely pays around 50% roalties so about $1,400 giving them a gross profit of... $1100

that's before printing costs for books (which they update with every major feature release) the purchase of the dongles (with serial number configuration) from safenet, printing the artwork on the box, and shipping the materials from their manufacturing plants to their distribution centers.  not to mention the logistical costs in back end for developing the technology for the web registration to update their internal records

AND shipping from the Avid webstore ranges from FREE (5 business days) to $22 for overnight (you can pay $250 for priority FIRST overnight, but you'll have FedEx knocking on your door at 5am for about 10 seconds and you won't see your package for another day if you miss them)

So selling Media Composer (and all of its ancilary Avid Apps) to a student for $300 - Avid just CAN'T include the 3rd party software.  know what i say to that kid?  take $30 and get Quicktime Pro to make your Mpeg-2s or your small QT movies and use the version of sonic that came with your lHP or Dell aptop, or use iDVD that came with your macbook.

or if you have to send your teacher a WMV, the export options are in media composer.  need to make a flash?  Well your school should have a lab for that kind of use. 

Know what else i say to that kid in college? "When i was YOUR age (and that was only 6-10 years ago) I had to sign up for my 4 hours of Avid Time on the one day a week i didn't have to slave at my part time job.  and even if i was 10 minutes late for my booked time - i lost it.  i would have KILLED to have Media Composer and only Media composer in my dorm room.  You kids today with your professional-quality-super-fast laptops and your quad and 8-core desktops and your 4GB of RAM  in your dorm room - with your myspace and your youtube - don't know how good you have it!"

Plus, wasn't Avid offering the "production" upgrade to full-blown Media Composer PLUS 3rd party stuff for like $1000 after graduation? (that offer may have expired....)

Kids, Save your pennies and your $5 for your keg cups for Thursty Thursdays, cause several grand for an I/O box is NOTHING compared to the costs you'll incur for the rest of your life.  Especially if it will help you grow as a professional.  Make wise investments now that will only help you down the road.

FunkyDragon:

Kids, Save your pennies and your $5 for your keg cups for Thursty Thursdays, cause several grand for an I/O box is NOTHING compared to the costs you'll incur for the rest of your life.  Especially if it will help you grow as a professional.  Make wise investments now that will only help you down the road.

Absolutely right. Think about amortizing your investment over time, not about what you're shelling out up front for the purchase. Reliability and stability are the keys to recouping your investment and running in the black. Build for the future, not for today.