Easy there Terry -

You are becoming more of a lone wolf out there begging to keep a redundant product line.  We just got rid of Xpro and a little more can be done.  More and more, experienced Avid people, in and out of the company are realizing that MC and Symph are too close and could be merged.  Call it a Symphony if it helps your clients pay a higher rate.  Just combine them (and there is about a 15% feature difference between the two, if that much?) to make one mid-level product, and then let us choose an IO that fits our needs.  MC with all the features of DS and Symphony?  Absolutely.  I would buy one in a heartbeat but at what cost?

I guess in the long form market, Symphony holds a bit of sway, but in my spot oriented world, it has nothing. If there is a recognizeable brand for Avid, its Media Composer, certainly not Symphony. My clients just know we use "Avid" to offline and DS or an Autoscreet product to finish.  They have no clue, so its up to us to guide them to the best products for the job.

If the new team at Avid is to be believed, there are very good days ahead for DS, so no sour grapes here.  If not, well you win!  But it would be foolish for Avid to give up the high-ground DS can play in in favor of a redundant product like Symphony.

lets not do this argument again!  Done.

sw

 BLKDOG, will they still support the adrenaline ?

Ex: capturing new codecs ,will it be possible with the adrenaline box?

MC v3? future v4?

.

thanks

Mike

Yes Mike, the old DNAs will still be supported. There is an FAQ all about this in the general forum.

new codecs, etc. are anybody's guess 'cause we only deal with what is here now. Speculation is not allowed.  The support for RT thin raster playback will only be with the New hardware.

switthaus:

My clients just know we use "Avid" to offline and DS or an Autoscreet product to finish. 

Completely different in my market. You should get rid of Newscutter also by your argument. But that is what the broadcasters know.

See, it's not as cut and dried as you make it sound.

You need to check out more markets than yours before you call for an end to a product. What Avid needs to do is give us the additional tools they should have been adding to Symphony for the last 8 years.

To this day, when I offer to let an offline editor work on a Symphony they are afraid. It really is perceived as a different system. That translates into market dollars in my universe. If Avid makes the whole product have one name, then it's just like FCP. And they will have to price accordingly.

TCurren:

switthaus:

My clients just know we use "Avid" to offline and DS or an Autoscreet product to finish. 

Completely different in my market. You should get rid of Newscutter also by your argument. But that is what the broadcasters know.

Forgive me if I show my ignorance on the subject as I'm not too familiar with newscutter by a large margin, but isn't newscutter a pretty different system?  That's my main thing with trimming the product line.  Symphony and MC just don't seem to have a big enough difference to warrant two separate products.  DS is obviously way different, and newscutter I think is different (then again, I could be totally off base here).

SandmanX82:

I'm not too familiar with newscutter by a large margin, but isn't newscutter a pretty different system?

Same code base, different feature sets as I understand it.

SandmanX82:

Forgive me if I show my ignorance on the subject as I'm not too familiar with newscutter by a large margin, but isn't newscutter a pretty different system? 

Hi,

Newscutter is like a mix of Xpress Pro and Media Composer.  Some of the features that were in Xpress Pro (how it worked in segment mode is one of the biggest) are in Newscutter, but it also includes a lot of Media Composer features.  Anyone who can edit on either Xpress Pro or Media Composer (or Symphony, for that matter) can edit on Newscutter.

Where it differs is that it's often (not always) employed in an environment with Avid storage & workgroup stuff like Unity Isis and Interplay, and that can take a little getting used to, but once you get the hang of how a facility organizes things, it's awesome.

good luck,
Carl

camoscato:

SandmanX82:

Forgive me if I show my ignorance on the subject as I'm not too familiar with newscutter by a large margin, but isn't newscutter a pretty different system? 

Hi,

Newscutter is like a mix of Xpress Pro and Media Composer.  Some of the features that were in Xpress Pro (how it worked in segment mode is one of the biggest) are in Newscutter, but it also includes a lot of Media Composer features.  Anyone who can edit on either Xpress Pro or Media Composer (or Symphony, for that matter) can edit on Newscutter.

Where it differs is that it's often (not always) employed in an environment with Avid storage & workgroup stuff like Unity Isis and Interplay, and that can take a little getting used to, but once you get the hang of how a facility organizes things, it's awesome.

good luck,
Carl

That clears things up a bit.  Thanks.

Having only had experience in a facility using Inferno, Flame and Smoke, I'm really keen for someone to explain to me just what the Avid DS does in comparison to Discreet's lineup. I've never seen a DS in action and it's something I really would like to.

For many TV commercials I've worked on the discreet tools are used to clean up a lot of the footage, for example rows of tea plants in a plantation will get their gaps painted in with more foliage etc. I was wondering if the DS is capable of this type of paint/repair work or is it geared towards other tasks?

Also I'm ignorant to what distinguishes the Symphony from the DS in terms of the work done on them and how their toolset differs in respect of the work. Although I believe their interface is different as the DS, as far as I know, is for heavy effects work. 

Back on topic, it is of my opinion that the new pricing of Media Composer is a real help to give access to anyone who is genuinely interested in Avid editing. To me that's a very positive move. The hardware side of it, at present still seems that for most is still optional and not buying into the hardware won't cripple anyone's ability to edit. By not having the hardware it may limit connectivity to decks and preview monitors etc. but not stop the editing process. As far as I can gather some of the hardware lineup will allow more power to be harnessed from the editing system but there seem to be a couple of queries not quite cleared up yet. I'm waiting for the official release before making any conclusions.

However, if the new lower price of MC allows Xpress Pro users and others to climb onto the MC horse, it's now possible to earn (or continue to earn) hopefully more income that eventually will make the hardware an easy purchase in the future.

Thanks in advance to those who kindly make me the wiser on Avid's higher end products.

J.

Whoops! posted this on the wrong thread! Meant to put it on the marketing thread. Oldtimer's disease must be setting in  . .sorry

What about an "Avid vs. The Competition" comparison chart? Maybe a side by side grid with the top 4 or 5 most recognizable packages on the market. No dissing, just an honest comparison chart. Even though I'm an Avid user through and through, I would be interested in taking a look at one of those. It could even feature configurations of the different flavors of Avid, and compare features and benefits with the other guys.

Obviously, there would be a segment of people who would focus on the price comparison, but if this grid looks the way I imagine it would, it could make a pretty strong statement.

Just a thought . .

Hi Brickward

I would like to see the Avid line and their hardware options etc. in a matrix like was done for AXP with Quicktime. But in the current situation at Avid it feels that they're busy re-aligning their products and so probably it's not the best time to make a matrix, at least not until MC 3 is released.

For a comparison of the other software, I worry that it would just not be able to take into account of important factors, such as the fact that FCS does have Color which is good, but the chart probably won't be able to take into account the work flow which will affect editing.  Sometimes a round trip to Color is good, sometimes annoying - this all depends on work flow and subjective opinion which will probably tear the chart to pieces. Just my humble opinion, but in an ideal world it would be nice. 

Anyway I'm actually feeling quite excited about MC 3.

TCurren:

 

You need to check out more markets than yours before you call for an end to a product. What Avid needs to do is give us the additional tools they should have been adding to Symphony for the last 8 years.

 

To this day, when I offer to let an offline editor work on a Symphony they are afraid. It really is perceived as a different system. That translates into market dollars in my universe. If Avid makes the whole product have one name, then it's just like FCP. And they will have to price accordingly.

Terry -

I have done long from broadcast as well, so it's a more rounded view than you may surmise.  I am not sure what difference a consolidated product would have on your business.  Instead of MC and Symphony rates, you simply charge offline and online rates.  The quality of the work would be the same, but if it had Media Composer as a name, would you have to lower your rates?  What if the consolidated product was called Symphony?  Does that keep your rates up?

As far as Avid pricing goes, keeping a products price high just to keep a name makes no sense, especially when the lower cost competition competes with it at many levels and ITS OWN PRODUCTS can do 85% of the work for a fraction of the cost (MC to Symph).  I may be way off base, but more consolidation almost seems inevitable..

Newscutter seems to be a more specialized product for a certain market but I can state that I have never sat behind one...

best -

sw

>>Having only had experience in a facility using Inferno, Flame and Smoke, I'm really keen for someone to explain to me just what the Avid DS does in comparison to Discreet's lineup. I've never seen a DS in action and it's something I really would like to.<<

Puddy, contact me offline, I'll e-vite you a virtual demo. mforrest@postboxpost.com

Michael

Puddy:

 

I would like to see the Avid line and their hardware options etc. in a matrix like was done for AXP with Quicktime. But in the current situation at Avid it feels that they're busy re-aligning their products and so probably it's not the best time to make a matrix, at least not until MC 3 is released.

 

 

Hi Puddy,

Have you seen the NLE Guide on Avid.com:

http://www.avid.com/products/professionalfilm_matrix.asp

Adam, great matrix. I never knew it existed. A couple of minor corrections, DS has a software solution - the DS Assist and it has Secondary color correction, not implemented the same as Symphony, but it's there.

Michael