Hi

I 've already asked this question on the MC forum, but couldn't get any answer.

The subject is Boris RED. I would like to add a better chroma keyer than the resident Boris chroma keyer. Boris RED is supposed to be AEX (After Effects plug ins) compatible. I  just tried the DFT Zmatte plug ins, but it makes Boris and Avid crash.

Does anybody here have any idea.

Many thanks for answer.

I don't think I understand the question Sep. Are you asking if the Boris Red Plugs are AE compatible?

Hi Todd, i'll try to explain better.

Here, when I speak about plug ins, you may understand plug ins FOR Boris (RED),

When I apply a BorisFX on a clip on  the Avid timeline, it is NOT possible to perform concurrently 2 FX. (Boris + an other AVX, a chroma key FX for instance) The job I am currently doing requires a real compositing , made of 3 stills, 4 different videos, one of which with chroma key (everything in a "container"). I must do the chroma key INSIDE Boris. Here is the problem, the resident Boris Chroma Keyer is TOO "basic" . So I thought I may use a AEX plug-in which may be Boris compatible, I tried ZMatte (DFT) and Primatte keyer. both show up in Boris effect palette,  but once applied everything crashes, Boris AND Avid.

Here's my issue, better explained, I hope !

THANKS FOR HELP

Yes you did. No you can't do that.

Although the AE plug is compatible with boris, it is not compatible inside the Avid interface. So, with Avid running, you will get problems like these.

 It's Avid independant, even the standalone Boris RED "engine" crashes. I am convinced I can do that, all the BCC FX included in Boris RED are AEX FX, and they work. The only thing I must find is a qualified AEX chroma keyer for Boris. I have sent several e mails to Artel with no answer, I tried on Cow Boris forum, but there I am "filtered out" (I don't know why) and must wait for the good will of moderators, I also contacted Digital Filmp Tools who said that effectively ZMatte is NOT certified for Boris, indeed, no tests never have be made. I MUST find a solution, I don't want to go "outside" to AE for all that stuff. 

It is Avid independent but isn't it launched from within the Avid interface? I have found the same conflicts you have with Red (Although long ago, I don't use it anymore).

Do you not use the Specramatte keyer Sep? I really like it and have, on occasion, gotten better keys from it than I do with AE's keylight.

 Yes Todd, I use Spectramatte frequently, we do many chroma key, I also use, Adventedge (Ultimatte), Zmatte, Primatte, Boris BCC, But here I try to explain again.*

When you do "compositing" using Boris, you apply 1 FX to a clip, you can't add another FX to the Boris RED FX, for instance, you have made a complex compositing, and want to key out someone on a background, you are not able to cumulate a RED FX and a spectrazmatte FX on the same clip, the picture I want to key out, will be resized, will move, will rotate......and all these settings are made "inside" Boris. So a Spectramatte FX is not possible here !

All I need is a GOOD chroma key plug in which may be used "inside" Boris. Boris is, in theory, AEX (After Effects FX) compatible, anyway, that's what Artel claims.

"It is Avid independent but isn't it launched from within the Avid interface? I have found the same conflicts you have with Red (Although long ago, I don't use it anymore)."

Yes, it is launched from Avid, but Boris has a standalone "engin" which may be used for tests without any host editing program. The plug ins I mentionned also crash the standalone version.

Got it.

I do this pretty often using plugs like Sapphire and BCC. Depends on how you have to use the Chroma key though.

I think you may be stuck using AE.

I am unable to do this compsiting job in Avid, I acknowledge, I could do it in AE, but the export-import-render-reexport-reimport process irritates me, you can't imagine. This is, in my opinion a waste of time......That's why, I like the Boris software, mostly because it behaves itself as a plug in, and result, let's say rendering is for "immediate use" in Avid.  

A long time ago I got Elastic Gasket bundled with Avid, I think for version 4.x but I never used it. I think it was supposed to allow After Effects Plugins to work in Avid. Perhaps anyone who's used it can help you Sep or if you have it already somewhere you could try it out.

It's interesting what you say in your last post. I'm finding that AE and Premiere really do work well together and I'm finding I'm spending less time with my Avid. I still prefer the way I could edit in Avid and I really like the color corrector in Avid too. But Avid at times can be a little awkward and this is a good example.

Since Todd mentioned Sapphire, there's a downloadable demo for the Sapphire plugins on their website so you could see if that solves your problem.

  Hi

Many thanks for answer. I have Elastic Gasket, and use it for some AEX FX inside the Avid. But here the problem is rather different. This problem can't be solved with Elastic Gasket or even Genarts Sapphire (I own too). Here you must imagine tha following situation : Boris, in my case, is a compositing software, considerd as a plug in, just because it can be launched from the Avid timeline. But other FX can't be added to Boris on the timeline, this is NOT possible. If you want to modify, set add a filter, an FX etc... or anything else, you must do it INSIDE Boris. So any AVX plug ins whatever they are CAN'T actually be used. The plug ins which may help me are AEX, but must be Boris compatible, Elastic Gasket makes some AEX Avid compatible. otherwise, AEX FX are supposed to be Boris compatible, but noboidy can't explain me why  Primatte keyer or DFT ZMatte make Boris crash. 

 For those who would be interested !

http://forums.creativecow.net/readpost/15/857715

Sep,

It might not be the most elegant solution but could you pull your key with Spectramatte, select "Show Alpha" so that you get the Alpha in the sequence window. Export that as a quicktime reference file, discard the Spectramatte key, apply Boris and then import your Quicktime reference file into Boris as a matte track for your composite?

It's been a while since I've ran Boris, but I seem to remember doing this once or twice.

cheers,

AC

acedits:

Sep,

It might not be the most elegant solution but could you pull your key with Spectramatte, select "Show Alpha" so that you get the Alpha in the sequence window. Export that as a quicktime reference file, discard the Spectramatte key, apply Boris and then import your Quicktime reference file into Boris as a matte track for your composite?

It's been a while since I've ran Boris, but I seem to remember doing this once or twice.

cheers,

AC

if you discard the Spectramatte, then QT refernence wouldnt work. But this does give me an idea.

Put your green screen shot on V1. use specramatte or Zmatte to pull the key, turn on show alpha.  then place the green screeen shot on V2 again. On V2 add a Boris Red 2 input effect.  When you get into Boris you'll have your green screen shot on V1 and a black and white matte of it on V2.  Apply a Linear luma key to the Black and White Matte.  Then drop that on the mask track of V1 in boris.  Then you have your key. Put all that in a Precompute so you can move them around easily and then composite away.

THX mr_difficult 

Interesting, really, I am not sure I will be able to reproduce this through and through, but I'll print your post and follow what you describe here ASAP

THX