Latest post Wed, Feb 14 2018 4:25 PM by Telegram!. 3 replies.
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  • Tue, Feb 13 2018 11:14 AM

    Sync audio to edited timeline

    So I have a sequence of a music event that I rough edited with the sound from my camera.

    Now I eventually got access to decent BW audio from the event of stuff that happened on stage and I want to sync it up to the releveant clips in my timeline.

    Timecode is basically time of day in both cases, so I can sync up rough and tweak it by 2 or 3 frames.

     

    In this case I want to do some kind of auto sync to the clips in the timeline, but I'm not sure if it's possible. I usually do this before I start editing.

    Do I have to match every clip - or can I do some kind of autosync of the audio to the V1 timecode in a sequence (ie. source timecode)?

    As per Avid on my avid machines. [view my complete system specs]
  • Wed, Feb 14 2018 10:07 AM In reply to

    Re: Sync audio to edited timeline

    NotsoLinearEditor:
    I usually do this before I start editing.

    That's the only way I know. I'm not aware of an easy/quick way to sync up new audio to a sequence that's already been edited. (If there is a way, hopefully someone smarter than me will chime in.)

    Media Composer 2018.7 w/Symphony/SS/PF options, HP Envy 17t-j100 Quad Edition laptop, Windows 10 Pro, Intel Core i7 2.4GHz, 16 GB RAM, nVidia GeForce GT... [view my complete system specs]

    "There is hardly anything in the world that some man cannot make a little worse and sell a little cheaper, and the people who only consider the price are this man's lawful prey."  - John Ruskin (1819-1900)

     

    Carl Amoscato | Freelance Film & Video Editor | London, UK

  • Wed, Feb 14 2018 1:01 PM In reply to

    Re: Sync audio to edited timeline

    Thanks for the response.

    I do kind of expect Media Composer to have an out of the box solution to this kind of thing, but I confess that I have never really been dedicated to finding out if it's possible before. I get so many errors and unexpected results using the auto tools that I kind of lost interest. The help still reads as if we are all still using tape.

    I know that Plural eyes does sync for audio without TC, it's a common problem to sync external audio to video, and some NLE's support Pluraleyes - but having said that, we have TC in all media in this case in composer, so it should be possible to use it as a sync source to a sequence somehow. We should be able to sync later and not just be constrained into doing sync first and grouping. In the real world we need flexible tools, not rigid methods.

    Conform A or V by source TC is really useful - I've done it externally with EDL's and XML's on colorgraders and compositors for replacing VFX shots, or for adding or finding audio clips - but never seen it in Media Composer.

    Maybe there is some smart way to relink a sequence of 'master' clips, but to link to groups instead? as I can of course group the V (masterclips) with the TC of the audio, I just need a way to keep the work already done on the edited sequences that were made without the extra audio that was not available at the time the were cut.

    As per Avid on my avid machines. [view my complete system specs]
  • Wed, Feb 14 2018 4:25 PM In reply to

    Re: Sync audio to edited timeline

    NotsoLinearEditor:

    Thanks for the response.

    I do kind of expect Media Composer to have an out of the box solution to this kind of thing, but I confess that I have never really been dedicated to finding out if it's possible before. I get so many errors and unexpected results using the auto tools that I kind of lost interest. The help still reads as if we are all still using tape.

    I know that Plural eyes does sync for audio without TC, it's a common problem to sync external audio to video, and some NLE's support Pluraleyes - but having said that, we have TC in all media in this case in composer, so it should be possible to use it as a sync source to a sequence somehow. We should be able to sync later and not just be constrained into doing sync first and grouping. In the real world we need flexible tools, not rigid methods.

    Conform A or V by source TC is really useful - I've done it externally with EDL's and XML's on colorgraders and compositors for replacing VFX shots, or for adding or finding audio clips - but never seen it in Media Composer.

    Maybe there is some smart way to relink a sequence of 'master' clips, but to link to groups instead? as I can of course group the V (masterclips) with the TC of the audio, I just need a way to keep the work already done on the edited sequences that were made without the extra audio that was not available at the time the were cut.

     

    There's a *possible* magic bullet, and at least, a probable helpful concept that I like to suggest. Auxilliary TC. It's one of the few things that you can add, after the fact, to an edited Sequence's clip, as well as your other clips.

    By now, you may have synced your old audio to the new BW you described getting. Perhaps you are lucky and you edited from a single masterclip initially and now your BW audio is also a single clip and they stay in sync for the duration.. I suppose that each clip may have a different starting point and duration. Auxilliary TC lets you "transfer" TC info from one source and combine it with the Regular TC of another. So you can see two TC's instead of just one... useful in situations like this.

    Maybe you can see if you can Clip/Modify the Auxilliary TC1 on both your original masterclip and the new BW so that they share a common Auxilliary TC1 at an early sync point. I call this a Sync Sequence or Sync Map. This will require some minor math as your BW clip probably has a different duration and likely a different duration backwards to get to the very Start of the clip-- which is what the Auxilliary TC1 value defines. The goal is to have an Auxilliary TC1 at your sync point that matches the original masterclip's TC at the sync point. The actual Auxilliary TC1 you input on the BW is that number minus the distance backwards to the start of the BW clip. 

    I'm curious if you can use MC's Relink tool, specifically the Relink to Selected Sequence with Auxilliary TC1 dialed in to have your new BW replace the original sound in your original edit Sequence. I would try it-- but without expectation of immediate success since the dark arts of Relink can be difficult to master.

    This is the Avid MC “What’s New” for v6.5 which has a great Auxilliary TC Relink explanation and sample of using Auxilliary TC on pages 13-17. 

    http://www.delmarlearning.com/companions/content/1133727980/companionfiles/MC101%20XF_final.pdf

    Looking it over, it’s not clear to me if your new BW file’s Auxillliary TC1 value must have the same value as your original’s normal Starting TC (or just include TC used in your edited Sequence); also, whether your new BW file needs to have a similar name as the original (a different extension seems OK, if indicated in Relink Settings) and if the new BW file must be the same duration and DF/NDF status.

    It is important to work with Bins that have Auxilliary TC column visible.

    ***It would be great if we all could nail down those particular Relink requirements! Please, anyone with those answers, chime in...

    You *might* have to temporarily Unlink your Orig edited clip used in your original sequence to even try it.

    And I suggest that you work off a Copy of your edited Sequence to be safe.

    So if all that Relinking doesn’t work out, you can still use the Auxilliary TC to help show what TC numbers to dial in to the new BW in your source monitor to match what you see at the start of each edit in your orig edited sequence. Then use Replace edit for the sound. If I were you, I'd make a GroupClip with the Orig and new BW in sync so that those Replace edits maintain an option for hearing the original.

    There's more on this exact topic "Auxilliary TC" scattered in the forum archives, from many others dealing with audio (as well as video) workarounds —- the bottom line is that this the kind of mistake you make once and try to avoid NEXT time, by setting up a Group clip including a "temp" wav of the projected duration of the real wav you will eventually receive. Then you can easily Relink later - as long as the mixer doesn't change the timebase/duration of the original source clip and you use the same name as your "temp" wav.

     

    good luck.

     

    Windows7 Pro; HP 820z, 16GB ram; Composer Nitris DX, Squeeze v8.5 Pro _____ Windows10 Pro x64 Dell XPS 8930 Special Edition Tower i7-8700 3.2 Ghz; 32GB... [view my complete system specs]
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