Latest post Mon, Dec 4 2017 10:48 PM by Guywithcat. 14 replies.
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  • Fri, Dec 1 2017 4:48 PM

    stuttering in 4k ugh

    Hi

    We have a brand new HP z840, with dual E5-2634 v4 Xeon processors at 2.2ghz (10 cores each) and 32gb of ram. Video card is m4000 with drivers avid recommended. It is connected over cat-6 gigabit to an EVO SAN with 96tb and raid 5. We have a single 17 minute clip shot in AVC Intra 4k 422 on the Panasonic Varicam that is shot VLOG in an MXF wrapper -- and that plays fine. But as soon as we put like 1 or 2 color changes to it to make it brighter or darker, it starts to stutter. Am I missing something here? We also have the very very latest version of MC (I forgot the number but it was upgraded like a couple days ago to the newest) and an ARTIST I/O. Is it that my system is not strong enough? Seems like a crazy idea considering my friend edits this same stuff on his high end macbook, i think. What can we do?

    Help!?

    HP z840, with dual E5-2634 v4 Xeon processors at 2.2ghz (10 cores each). 32GB ram. NVIDIA m4000 video card. EVO SAN with 96tb and raid 5 over Cat6. Artist... [view my complete system specs]

    I think we need a few more digital HD formats

  • Fri, Dec 1 2017 5:01 PM In reply to

    Re: stuttering in 4k ugh

    Its likley to be pure CPU grunt as the bottleneck.

    The playback off the server is the same. The LUT is a realtime effect. The AVC Intra is very CPU inmtensive to decode.

    Then add on more colour corrections and you'll see it struggle.

    Transcode to DNxHR and see how that compares. My monies on it playing much better.

    also 2.2GHz CPU speeds aren't the fastest. Lots of cores is great but after a point they can't really help you.

    I prefer faster CPUs 3GHz or more. Those E5-2634 can go up to 3.3GHz thats 50% more CPU power.

    As for the mac book I think the fastest ones will run at 3.6GHz

    ACI Moderator. I'm not employed by Avid or work for them. I just do this in my spare time. Symphony V8.6 / 8.3.1 HP Z400 system [view my complete system specs]

     

    Broadcast & Post Production Consultant / Trainer  VET

     

    T 07581 201248 | E pat@vet.co.uk | W www.vet.co.uk |


    Media Composer V8.2 Review Background Render

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  • Sat, Dec 2 2017 10:44 AM In reply to

    • Bruno M
    • Top 500 Contributor
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    • London, UK
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    Re: stuttering in 4k ugh

    I'm afraid Pat's right. The demands that today's camera formats make on our systems mean that you really need both high core counts and high CPU speeds. Even this may not be enough when you start adding in noise reduction/de-bayering etc, which is why grading workstations often add two or more high-end GPUs or even additional specialist cards (eg. Rocket-X).

    You might be interested in this article by Puget systems about a single core i7 verses two Xeons.

    https://www.pugetsystems.com/labs/articles/Should-you-use-a-Dual-Xeon-for-Premiere-Pro-CC-2017-932/

    To be honest, 2.2Ghz CPUs are just not going to be able to perform as well as the latest Core i9 processors, which are turbo boosting to around 4.4Ghz.

    As Pat says, transcode your footage to Avid-friendly media and things will run a lot smoother.

    HP Z800,HP8600,HP8760WSonnetFusion RAID, Mediadock U320, Classic Nitris Mojo DXSymphony 5,6 & 8.5 JVC DTV1910 HD tube monitor, HP Dreamcolor, [view my complete system specs]
  • Sat, Dec 2 2017 7:44 PM In reply to

    • Tom Pearson
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    Re: stuttering in 4k ugh

    I agree I tranccode everything I injest and I have no issues using a mbp i 7 

    macbook pro i7 2.5 16 gig ram 750gig hd 2tb fw800 20 tb e-sata raid Artist Mix and Artist color Artist control [view my complete system specs]

    Tom Pearson

    Director/Writer Big Picture Films

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  • Sat, Dec 2 2017 11:33 PM In reply to

    Re: stuttering in 4k ugh

    Thanks everyone. I really do not have the bandwidth to transcode what will be 200 hours of footage. This means I need to get new machines. Avid insists that this strenght CPU (Note - the compute has two of them) can handle 3-6 streams of 4k. That said, the idea it cannot handle a single stream of AMA linked footage seems hard to swallow. There is no bigger project here. We just did a simple test with one clip and a couple color effects. Is it possible there is more to this or is it almost definitely still the CPU? And if it is the CPU, why is avid saying 3-6 streams of 4k? I understand Avid likely means 3-6 streams of DNxHR but again, this is one stream in an MXF wrapper with no lut -- just a couple color effects and nothing else.

    HP z840, with dual E5-2634 v4 Xeon processors at 2.2ghz (10 cores each). 32GB ram. NVIDIA m4000 video card. EVO SAN with 96tb and raid 5 over Cat6. Artist... [view my complete system specs]

    I think we need a few more digital HD formats

  • Sun, Dec 3 2017 2:01 PM In reply to

    Re: stuttering in 4k ugh

    Its all about the codec codec codec codec.

    MXF wrapped or not this is the difference between LongGOP media and frame based media. So yes DNxHR will outperform LongGOP source media by a mile.

    It isn't that its AMA linked (you can AMA linke DNxHR content and it will play fine) its the source codec. Great for aquision hopeless for editing.

    ACI Moderator. I'm not employed by Avid or work for them. I just do this in my spare time. Symphony V8.6 / 8.3.1 HP Z400 system [view my complete system specs]

     

    Broadcast & Post Production Consultant / Trainer  VET

     

    T 07581 201248 | E pat@vet.co.uk | W www.vet.co.uk |


    Media Composer V8.2 Review Background Render

    -

    Follow me on Twitter Pat_H_VET

  • Sun, Dec 3 2017 3:13 PM In reply to

    Re: stuttering in 4k ugh

    What is the pagefile of yours and are you on W10?

    Desktop
    Corsair RM750X/Asus P8Z68 Deluxe(Gen3)/i7 2600K@4.4/Corsair 32G DDR3/PNY Quadro P2000D(385.08)/Samsung 850 Pro SSD(OS) 256 GB/ 2x2TB WD RE4@RAID 0/LG BH16NS40/W10 Pro 64bit/Media Composer Software 8.9.3 with Symphony • PhraseFind • ScriptSync Option/2xHP 22'' Monitors/M-Audio AV30 Speakers.

     

    Larry as long as I live I will remember you.

     

    3 Heads Digital MediaVienna Frames

  • Sun, Dec 3 2017 5:43 PM In reply to

    Re: stuttering in 4k ugh

    You really need a lot of RAM for MC work. 16GB min I'd say 32GB better 64GB great.

    An SSD boot drive and fast media drives.

    Then pagefile isn't that significant. Normally it should be 1.5X the RAM amount.

     

    ACI Moderator. I'm not employed by Avid or work for them. I just do this in my spare time. Symphony V8.6 / 8.3.1 HP Z400 system [view my complete system specs]

     

    Broadcast & Post Production Consultant / Trainer  VET

     

    T 07581 201248 | E pat@vet.co.uk | W www.vet.co.uk |


    Media Composer V8.2 Review Background Render

    -

    Follow me on Twitter Pat_H_VET

  • Sun, Dec 3 2017 9:09 PM In reply to

    • AntCaladine
    • Top 500 Contributor
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    Re: stuttering in 4k ugh

    A couple of questions for you.

    are you monitoring 10bit or 8bit. 10bit is more system intensive, so drop down to 8 until you’ve rendered or really need to see in 10.

    you say your footage is coming over cat6 network. How many other machines are accessing that san at the same time. Network isn’t that quick. Even worse if more accessing at same time.

    to test copy a file locally to your system drive. Hopefully ssd and try from there. It’ll prob perform better.

    as others have said. Transcode. I appreciate you’ve a lot of footage, but AMA isn’t for editing directly from. It’s for quick ingest.

    3x HP Z820 16GB ram, Win10 Pro 64bit, Nvidia Quadro 4000 AMC 8.9.2, 2x Aja IO, 1x Blackmagic 4k Studio 16TB T-Box Shared Storage with 8gb Fibre connection... [view my complete system specs]
  • Sun, Dec 3 2017 10:47 PM In reply to

    Re: stuttering in 4k ugh

    Hi all

    OK a few things. 1) Windows 10  2) 10 bit  3) No other machines are on the SAN. Not even mounted -- Zero. 4) We have 32gb of ram. but get this -- the moment we pen AVID it spikes to say we are using 95% of our ram. This is before we even open a project. When we open and HD or a 4k project it makes no difference. Ram use goes up to as much as 96% and never below high 80s. CPU usage never goes about 52% even when we play back the (Non-transcoded) footage with a bunch of effects on it. CPU use tends to hover around 40% with lows in mid 30s (soundsl ike the weather). Any reason the mere opening of Avid would use up all that memory?

    And if we need to transcode then we will. But right now, I am wondering why we are using so much memory???? Could this be the culprit to the stuttering as well?

    And an update -- we just  tried in Safe Mode and the same things happened.

    Oh we also have SSD boot drive.

    HP z840, with dual E5-2634 v4 Xeon processors at 2.2ghz (10 cores each). 32GB ram. NVIDIA m4000 video card. EVO SAN with 96tb and raid 5 over Cat6. Artist... [view my complete system specs]

    I think we need a few more digital HD formats

  • Sun, Dec 3 2017 11:08 PM In reply to

    • Bruno M
    • Top 500 Contributor
    • Joined on Thu, Feb 11 2010
    • London, UK
    • Posts 374
    • Points 4,615

    Re: stuttering in 4k ugh

    Guywithcat:
    I really do not have the bandwidth to transcode what will be 200 hours of footage.

    When you say 'bandwidth', do you mean the space on on your media drives or the amount of time it will take?

    If it's the former, you could always transcode to a proxy format for the edit, link back to camera originals once you have picture lock and then transcode the required material to a final, high quality Avid MXF format.

    HP Z800,HP8600,HP8760WSonnetFusion RAID, Mediadock U320, Classic Nitris Mojo DXSymphony 5,6 & 8.5 JVC DTV1910 HD tube monitor, HP Dreamcolor, [view my complete system specs]
  • Sun, Dec 3 2017 11:13 PM In reply to

    Re: stuttering in 4k ugh

    i mean time -- sorry about that!

    HP z840, with dual E5-2634 v4 Xeon processors at 2.2ghz (10 cores each). 32GB ram. NVIDIA m4000 video card. EVO SAN with 96tb and raid 5 over Cat6. Artist... [view my complete system specs]

    I think we need a few more digital HD formats

  • Mon, Dec 4 2017 11:16 AM In reply to

    Re: stuttering in 4k ugh

    Make sure that the pagefile is handled by Windows 10.

    If you are on a version that supports cache settings, lower those to around 15-16g inside MC settings.

    Also use the yellow/green timeline output setting as at 4K you really dont need it that much.

    Desktop
    Corsair RM750X/Asus P8Z68 Deluxe(Gen3)/i7 2600K@4.4/Corsair 32G DDR3/PNY Quadro P2000D(385.08)/Samsung 850 Pro SSD(OS) 256 GB/ 2x2TB WD RE4@RAID 0/LG BH16NS40/W10 Pro 64bit/Media Composer Software 8.9.3 with Symphony • PhraseFind • ScriptSync Option/2xHP 22'' Monitors/M-Audio AV30 Speakers.

     

    Larry as long as I live I will remember you.

     

    3 Heads Digital MediaVienna Frames

  • Mon, Dec 4 2017 8:41 PM In reply to

    Re: stuttering in 4k ugh

    I will do all that but i just checked all the same specs on another machine that is an exact clone of this one here and it runs without stuttering, CPU is the same but memory is never over 40% so somerhing is happening on this machine. Help!?

    HP z840, with dual E5-2634 v4 Xeon processors at 2.2ghz (10 cores each). 32GB ram. NVIDIA m4000 video card. EVO SAN with 96tb and raid 5 over Cat6. Artist... [view my complete system specs]

    I think we need a few more digital HD formats

  • Mon, Dec 4 2017 10:48 PM In reply to

    Re: stuttering in 4k ugh

    bbbuuummmppp

    HP z840, with dual E5-2634 v4 Xeon processors at 2.2ghz (10 cores each). 32GB ram. NVIDIA m4000 video card. EVO SAN with 96tb and raid 5 over Cat6. Artist... [view my complete system specs]

    I think we need a few more digital HD formats

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